Pakistan Army and Pakistan Airforce Airdefence Trials

[Super Falcon]

Dear after alot of research I came to conclusion that our airdefence is very weak because we posses one type of long range and two types of medium range and for low range we don't have more capable system like patsir but we have most of man portable systems and anti aircraft guns

I think army airforce should conduct airdefence drill against our airforce pilots every 3 years to know what are our holes to fill in

We do lot of drills but never heard of the airdefence drills

Only airdefence system we show to our army chief when they visit

Since our geographical map consist of all types of weathers

Terrain of high mountains to plains and seas

Since India is also circling us we can not depend on one or two kind of system

If HQ 9 get compromised our airspace won't be in our control.

Currently we have

HQ 9
LY 80
FM 90
Aspada
Mistral man portable
Anza


We lack low altitude system like patsir
And now we need chain of good air defence system specialy to sea shores and our Marines don't have more toys hand over them patsir batteries with few HQ 9 along with jamming systems drones and one more medium ranged airdefence system from Westlike aspada 2000

 

[Djinn]

When did Pakistan get HQ-9? Those rumors that Pakistan acquired them some time back are not credible enough.

 

[Super Falcon]

When did Pakistan get HQ-9? Those rumors that Pakistan acquired them some time back are not credible enough.

So it means we are even more valuable in time of war we only can destroy lower and medium targets and I'm not sure that we are less on them even if you look the size of IAF and than IN we need better airdefence system even a entire chain of command of airdefence system covering everything

In kargil we have destroyed Indian MIG 21 with man portable air launcher

Time has passed technology have evolved and IAF equipped itself with high tech jets they fly higher than the reach of our airdefence systems reach and with sniper pods fighter jets can destroy flying above 10000 feet every thing they want so it is a massive leap we must have 2 types of long range airdefence system

4 types of medium range and 2 types of lower medium range airdefence system

This time build a chain of command between all three forces to take these system distributed on equal basis to safeguard their respective field of operations

Marines role should be dedicated to coastal and air defence equipping them with more batteries of airdefence systems few tanks if IN landing ships get to our shores and few attack helicopter should be given to them

Marines can do wonders for us if provided good equipment army should start building their needs as army weapons also matches their needs too

 

[Zarvan]

For your information trials are taking place. Pakistan is testing various Air Defence systems and plan to induct them in large numbers.
@kaonalpha @Sulman Badshah @Tipu7

 

[Arsalan]

Trails aren't,, Studies are!!

 

[FNFAL]

In kargil we have destroyed Indian MIG 21 with man portable air launcher

A moment of clarification: Manpads are for low level engagements. The Mig21 was downed because it was flying at low level, trying to pickup the Mig27 on the ground. (which has engine malfunction) . It would not have been shot down if it flying outside the engagement envelope of the stinger/anza

That is why the IAF quickly changed its game in kargil and brought in the Mirage 2000s with Altis pods and LGBs. It never went in at low level.

Having said that you would always need a good manpad as the last resort- and these forms the inner most ring of a layered Air defence web..these are still.distributed amongst the common soldiers- less complex to learn and deploy but devastating at low ranges

 

[Zarvan]

Trails aren't,, Studies are!!

Some trials have taken place in Pakistan mainly Russian and Ukrainian and Turkish systems were tested but we are interested in South African as well as European systems. Pantsir S2 will definitely come don't know about How many other systems we want to buy.

 

[Arsalan]

Some trials have taken place in Pakistan mainly Russian and Ukrainian and Turkish systems were tested but we are interested in South African as well as European systems. Pantsir S2 will definitely come don't know about How many other systems we want to buy.

Definitely?

OK!
As being reported on Facebook?
We are not buying everything you like dear!

 

[Zarvan]

Definitely?

OK!
As being reported on Facebook?
We are not buying everything you like dear!

Don't believe me your choice but talk to Army Guys they would tell you trials have taken place and Pantsir S2 would come for sure. How many more systems we are interested in can't say
@kaonalpha @Horus @Sulman Badshah @Tipu7

 

[Arsalan]

Don't believe me your choice but talk to Army Guys they would tell you trials have taken place and Pantsir S2 would come for sure. How many more systems we are interested in can't say
@kaonalpha @Horus @Sulman Badshah @Tipu7

It is not that i have some grudge against you but you make things so difficult to believe

Those claims made as definitive as God himself have given you the information. NOTHING is "definite" but death!! Can you disagree with this? I dont think of all those people you will be the one to disagree with this!!

There are interests in systems, there is the requirement but when saying that this is "definitely" going to happen have you ever spared a moment and thought about number of things that could go wrong?

Sigh!

Should i need to quote incidents where there was interest, there was the needs, the officials were talking about it BUT things went wrong!! NOTHING HAPPENED!! So much for anything in military hardware procurement being definite!! When will you learn this very simple lesson?

 

[Zarvan]

It is not that i have some grudge against you but you make things so difficult to believe

Those claims made as definitive as God himself have given you the information. NOTHING is "definite" but death!! Can you disagree with this? I dont think of all those people you will be the one to disagree with this!!

There are interests in systems, there is the requirement but when saying that this is "definitely" going to happen have you ever spared a moment and thought about number of things that could go wrong?

Sigh!

Should i need to quote incidents where there was interest, there was the needs, the officials were talking about it BUT things went wrong!! NOTHING HAPPENED!! So much for anything in military hardware procurement being definite!! When will you learn this very simple lesson?

I am saying trials have taken place I am sure about that and I am sure about Pantsir S2. Other than that I have no idea about which Air Defense Systems and how many we may induct ?

 

[Arsalan]

I am saying trials have taken place I am sure about that and I am sure about Pantsir S2. Other than that I have no idea about which Air Defense Systems and how many we may induct ?

NO, you were saying that you are sure one system will come, it is definite!!

I was referring to this:

Don't believe me your choice but talk to Army Guys they would tell you trials have taken place and Pantsir S2 would come for sure. How many more systems we are interested in can't say
@kaonalpha @Horus @Sulman Badshah @Tipu7

Thus the question:

Those claims made as definitive as God himself have given you the information. NOTHING is "definite" but death!! Can you disagree with this? I dont think of all those people you will be the one to disagree with this!!

There are interests in systems, there is the requirement but when saying that this is "definitely" going to happen have you ever spared a moment and thought about number of things that could go wrong?

Sigh!

Should i need to quote incidents where there was interest, there was the needs, the officials were talking about it BUT things went wrong!! NOTHING HAPPENED!! So much for anything in military hardware procurement being definite!! When will you learn this very simple lesson?

Any answers?
Isn't it the same case that that other thread where you were talking about EF? All those 50 odd posts giving reasons and what you came up with?
https://defence.pk/threads/confirmed-pics-of-t-129-in-pakistan.435332/page-9#post-8395590

Perhaps you are right, i should just zip up and move on. Let you carry on with your life. No need to try an explain something when you wont even bother to answer when debunked. I am sorry for all this effort and attempts.

 

[ACE OF THE AIR]

The doctrine Pakistan focused on was an Indian Air Attack would come at a very low level. This is the reason Low level protection was made the immediate priority.

The reasons for a low lever Air Attack is that the enemy Radars do not pick the Attacking Aircraft. Even if they are picked they are mistaken for Ground Clatter. However this scenario has changed because Pakistan has purchased AEW&C aircraft that can potentially detect aircraft 500 miles inside Enemy Territory from the moment they lift off. Thus an attack is not limited to low level but can come in from medium and high level provided the aircraft can perform high level Bombing.

To counter Medium and High Level attacking formations PAF would resort to Air to Air Warfare. That is one of the main reason why Pakistan purchases aircraft that are agile and WVR training is conducted more than BVR by PAF pilots.

As the economy is still not doing well and the fighter aircraft have evolved into stealth the need of high level SAM has increased so that these targets can be identified and destroyed before they pose any danger to older generation aircraft.

 

[GURU DUTT]

The doctrine Pakistan focused on was an Indian Air Attack would come at a very low level. This is the reason Low level protection was made the immediate priority.

The reasons for a low lever Air Attack is that the enemy Radars do not pick the Attacking Aircraft. Even if they are picked they are mistaken for Ground Clatter. However this scenario has changed because Pakistan has purchased AEW&C aircraft that can potentially detect aircraft 500 miles inside Enemy Territory from the moment they lift off. Thus an attack is not limited to low level but can come in from medium and high level provided the aircraft can perform high level Bombing.

To counter Medium and High Level attacking formations PAF would resort to Air to Air Warfare. That is one of the main reason why Pakistan purchases aircraft that are agile and WVR training is conducted more than BVR by PAF pilots.

As the economy is still not doing well and the fighter aircraft have evolved into stealth the need of high level SAM has increased so that these targets can be identified and destroyed before they pose any danger to older generation aircraft.

thing is with advance in tech even a fighter like MKI flying at 8-10 or even higher like 10-18 Km altitude can destroy targets (even moving ones )with its PGMs , LGBs and SDBs very easily and hence you need something that is capble for 7-20Km altitude

and most QR-SR SAMS and MANPADs to at most from 4Km(MANPAD) to 10Km (QR-SR) specially those with PAF & PA and IAF has made its new doctroine on that while investing to go one level up hence PAF wants a system which is capable to be installed and functionsal in very short time something like panister or SPYDER with capability to engage any target not just in low but mediunm and even high altitude

 

[ACE OF THE AIR]

thing is with advance in tech even a fighter like MKI flying at 8-10 or even higher like 10-18 Km altitude can destroy targets (even moving ones )with its PGMs , LGBs and SDBs very easily and hence you need something that is capble for 7-20Km altitude

and most QR-SR SAMS and MANPADs to at most from 4Km(MANPAD) to 10Km (QR-SR) specially those with PAF & PA and IAF has made its new doctroine on that while investing to go one level up hence PAF wants a system which is capable to be installed and functionsal in very short time something like panister or SPYDER with capability to engage any target not just in low but mediunm and even high altitude

We have to wait and see what Pakistan gets may be both the systems that you have mentioned or some other. The doctrine of Pakistan could have taken the lead after the Arab Israel War 1973 when the Arab forces used SAM to bring down many Israeli Air Force aircraft.

Till then you enjoy your tea...