What's new

PAF vs. IAF Analysis- Air Combat Over the Subcontinent

Status
Not open for further replies.

Introvert

FULL MEMBER
Joined
Dec 28, 2006
Messages
1,056
Reaction score
3
Analysis of the PAF vs. IAF - Air Combat Over the Subcontinent

by M. Hussain

Pakistan and India. Two regional powers, frequently at war, armed to the teeth, possessing nuclear weapons and with no end in sight to their mutual animosity. War in the Subcontinent today has very high stakes. But none higher than in their respective air arms. Given the importance of air combat to modern warfare, a crucial factor to analyze the outcome of any conflict between them becomes analyzing the viability of each air force. For wars today always begin in air combat, and the successor there often has Fate decide in its favor.

The Pakistan Air Force has traditionally been known as one of the most professional air forces in the world. But the 1990s was a tough decade for the PAF and much of their prestige was lost. Pakistan chose to invest in nuclear weapons and diverted resources there. Damaging sanctions against Pakistan also hurt the PAF more than any other armed service. Thus, a decade was lost and PAF was left behind.
The Indian Air Force meanwhile, found the 1990s most fruitful. They progressed in leaps and bounds, as the Indian economy expanded, military equipment from the West and Russia opened up, and the IAF started learning and incorporating Western standards of air combat. Yet, there were times when India's political environment forced itself upon the IAF. Forced to wait for a local replacement for its MiG-21s that has been in development for over 20 years, and forced to abandon purchases because of political interference from within India, the IAF, on the turn of the century, found itself restrained.

Pakistan meanwhile gained momentum. Years of sanctions led to the development of a joint project with China - the JF-17. Unlike the Indian effort, this bore fruit quickly, under the able leadership of the PAF and astute decision making on the part of their military leader Musharraf. And after 9/11, the doors to Western equipment and military aid opened up again. But constant stalling plagued them such that little of concrete and operational value has been inducted. The PAF is nevertheless modernizing, and by 2012 would have caught up with the IAF. With induction in numbers of JF-17s and J-10s by the end of 2009, the PAF will see the gap vis-à-vis the IAF close rapidly.

Yet, in the Winter of 2008/2009, the PAF is yet half-made and the threat of war is thrust upon her. The PAF and IAF are on their highest alert, as the IAF sees its last opportunity to break the PAF, and the PAF holds strong and does not back down. The vital question thus becomes, what will happen if war broke out now? Today? Would the PAF collapse? Such a question cannot be answered without looking carefully at the assets and capabilities of both air forces.

The first salients we notice is that the IAF is far larger, with about 740 combat aircraft versus the PAF's approximate 400 aircraft. We see that the IAF has over 100 FLANKERs that are modernized and top-rate against the PAF's handful of early block F-16As. The IAF fields BVR missiles in platforms ranging from the MiG-21 Bisons to the Su-30 MKI against a PAF which officially does not have BVRs.

Yet, everything is not as it seems. What at first glance seems overwhelming odds against the PAF, on closer examination, do not seem as overwhelming. The IAF has far lower serviceability of its aircraft, their pilot training, as evidenced by recent Red Flag exercises with the US is also not yet up to par with the PAF, their maintenance crews are not as diligent, their mainly Russian/Soviet technology is generally less reliable and less effective than advertised, and a large part of their fleet of MiG-21s and MiG-27s are outdated. PAF aircraft are either of Western stock or Chinese and are far more maintenance friendly. Pakistan has also been upgrading their aircraft massively and have incorporated a complex combination of technology from across the globe – from China to Brazil, from South Africa to the US. PAF also very likely has BVRs that are not advertised of South African and Chinese origin. PAF pilot training is on par with the best in the world, and its maintenance crews are trained on the level of Western maintenance crews. Lastly, fighting an air war over Pakistan gives the PAF a home advantage and makes their radar and SAM infrastructure very relevant.

IAF aircraft are mainly of Soviet/Russian origin and are not designed for easy maintenance. The Soviets designed aircraft for mass production and on the view that combat aircraft would have short lives in a full scale conflict. As such, ease of maintenance was the last item on their mind. Even the latest Indian acquisition of Russian aircraft, the Su-30 MKI is known for being highly maintenance intensive and extremely fragile. Modifications to the FLANKERs have made them even more difficult to maintain – and example being that IAF sometimes faces tire shortages because the increased tonnage of the Indian FLANKERs make their tires burn out very rapidly.
Indian maintenance crews are also not up to par – at least compared to Western air forces. The large number of IAF crashes is indicative of this, one of the highest rates amongst air forces of the world. What compounds this problem is the age of large sections of the Indian fleet which has large numbers of MiG-21s and MiG-27s that are, besides the Bisons, highly outdated and are sometimes referred to as “Flying Coffins” by their pilots. It is no wonder that India has a hard time recruiting and retaining pilots .

Pakistan on the other hand has no problems recruiting pilots – the PAF has one of the highest rejection rates amongst air forces in the world. The PAF also has a better pilot to aircaft ratio than the IAF, meaning it could sustain a greater sortie rate over a protracted conflict. PAF aircraft are also “pimped” in that they have been extensively modified. Thus, while on paper PAF is flying ancient Mirages that were bought second hand from the Australians, when one actually examines any such model, one is surprised at how extensively they have been rebuilt – almost from scratch and the hardware is extremely lethal. Other than the secretive BVR AAMs, the PAF has extensively incorporated the strike element into its Mirages, at a level only matched by the IAF’s Mirage-2000s and Su-30 FLANKERs, and even then, some of the equipment has no IAF equivalent.

Let us also remember than any conflict between the two forces would last a maximum of 2 weeks as neither side has either the logistics or the political will to fight a longer war. This means that the smaller air force can sustain itself on a more equal footing for the briefer period of time.
The IAF’s fleet of MiG-21s are very short legged. the PAF’s F-7s have better ranges and also don’t need to fly as far given that they would be defending. Considering how large the IAF’s fleet of MiG-21, this becomes a rather relevant point. It would be hard to imagine IAF’s MiG-21s being able to sustain a presence over Pakistani airspace. Meanwhile, Pakistani cruise missiles and ballistic missiles are significantly more developed, effective and numerous than their Indian counterparts. This means that many of the forward Indian air bases would effectively be discounted, further compounding the problem for the IAF.

All these factors suggest a far more complex and mixed picture of the balance between the two air forces. To quantify military power in a more concrete way and to see how this balance plays out, let us look at a model of the PAF and the IAF.
Let us consider three main elements - number of aircraft, how valuable each aircraft is in battle and aircraft serviceability. We have the number of aircraft as a given. We assign percentages for serviceability, and assign a value between 0 and 1 for how effective each aircraft is. To get a broadly accurate picture, these numbers do not have to be absolutely accurate, but relatively accurate.

We find the aggregate combat value by multiplying each of the factors and the number of aircraft. As you notice, I have not included factors such as home advantage to the PAF, PAF’s higher pilot ratio or PAF’s better training. I have also not included the short-legged nature of the MiG-21s and India’s likely inability to lose (or risk not losing) their forward air bases, effectively rendering them nonoperational. These factors are more intrinsic and are harder to quantify, so I will leave the reader to judge by how much to upgrade the PAF’s score on these parameters, or discount the IAF’s.

I am assuming that Air-to-Ground capabilities will also be an important aspect as destroying enemy aircraft on the ground or important installations is a significant element of the air war. I therefore am holding higher numbers of effectiveness for aircraft on both sides that otherwise would be completely redundant such as the IAF MiG-27. Of course, Air-to-Air is more important generally but strike missions should also be considered relevant. As such the model is only moderately biased towards air-to-air capabilities.

Conclusion
It would appear that the IAF is still the superior force. And while accounting for the exogenous items in this model would further lower the gap than the massive 37% gap shown in the table, depending on how it is discounted, it is still decidedly in India’s favor. However, given the short nature of any conflict between India and Pakistan, the gap does not lend credibility to India attaining air superiority over Pakistan under any scenario as could be concluded if we took the 82% gap in numbers. The PAF would likely sustain significant causalities but would likely be able to deny the IAF any semblance of air superiority over Pakistan, at least for any conflict lasting up to a few weeks. As long as PAF can deny the IAF air superiority, it can be considered to have done its job and would be ready to pick the pieces up from where it left it in the last conflict over Kargil.

Grande Strategy: Analysis of the PAF vs. IAF - Air Combat Over the Subcontinent
 
Last edited:
PAF mirages better than IAF Mirage 2000s?? Could someone shed some light please?? And about BVRs, well I dont know much about it so not saying anything.
 
A very very interesting article, thanks for posting, great analysis. :tup:
Indians might read this and then hopefully they'll get a different perception of reality, instead of constantly thinking that their AF will destroy PAF within a matter of time.
 
that was the longest joke i ever read. mirage ????? IAF Have better pilots and planes. but i think pakistan has better mouth to talk about their planes. ( i am not counting pakistan small , never take your enemy lightly ).
well not completely a joke, its got some facts in place, and some heavy blunders to substitute the facts!
 
IAF Have better pilots and planes.


biggest joke ... oh joke of the year "IAF HAVE BETTER PILOTS" yaa ya ayaa we know that very well howz much ur pilots are highly trained and ur better airforce who had already lost 500 + planes" joke of the year!
 
PAF mirages better than IAF Mirage 2000s?? Could someone shed some light please?? And about BVRs, well I dont know much about it so not saying anything.
can someone answer this plz? If this is true then I will readily accept all the claims of the above article!
 
Let this thread not turn into a "who has the biggest weener contest".
The articles main message is that not everything seems as easy as it is, the real situation is rather complicated between Pakistan and India regarding airpower, and no one can really judge the outcome of an escalation by air between these two sides.
 
hahaha...yeah...mirage rose and the mirage V are way better than the IAF Su-30 and mirage 2000...IAf is indeed in bad shape!
well seriously what 'strike elements' can make the above happen?
..and is the author sure of paf having Bvr or not?...i know it's secret..
and then again we come back to pakstani missiles being better than indian missiles...
 
the IAF has china to worry about...PAf is surely smaller lesser capable than the Chinese...so in the process of 'worrying' about the PLAF...we achieve more...i dpnt know why you view our defence acquisitions with being Pakistan centeric...the trend is increasingly counter-Chinese now...except the latest Orion deal(to counter the growing PN sub strenght)
 
I don't have much time to read the article but Indians mirages are better then our mirages but as of know India cannot achieve air supremacy over Pakistan unless they get all 126 F18s but i am sure PAF will also get something to counter that but still the IAF will be far more stronger then PAF once their MRCA jets arrive.
 
the IAF has china to worry about...PAf is surely smaller lesser capable than the Chinese...so in the process of 'worrying' about the PLAF...we achieve more...i dpnt know why you view our defence acquisitions with being Pakistan centeric...the trend is increasingly counter-Chinese now...except the latest Orion deal(to counter the growing PN sub strenght)

Your post has nothing to do with this article at all.
It's viewing and analyzing the air superiority abilities and capabilities on both sides.
Pakistan sees defence acquisitions from India as a threat because everything India buys, CAN be used against Pakistan, and not only China, so stop it with the "we are concentrating on China" crap, it doesn't matter at all, and it's not relevant for this thread.
 
  • Like
Reactions: asq
well here's what we do...

you=pakistani viewpoint
me=indian viewpoint
obvious differences mate.
 
well here's what we do...

you=pakistani viewpoint
me=indian viewpoint
obvious differences mate.

Ofcourse, but dragging China into a PAF vs IAF analysis thread is not relevant and useful, so please lets stick to the topic.
 
and the article wrongly states that the indian pilots were found to be less capable by the americans in the red flag.i am open to an argument on this...yeah and the Mig-21 bison was eye opener now wasnt it....bettering the f-16..the USAF f-16
even the sea harrier of the IN has BVR...
the pilots...well without the use of the AWACS they bettered the USAf pilots in cope india...and we have our own AWACS...
or wait...maybe the PAf pilots happen to be more professional than the ones in USAF?
the fact remains...we've checked our pilots at cope india and red flag...and latest reults might not be as rosy as the conventional pakistani view...to be more exact we sadly shall have to wait for an engagement b/w the two airforces...
 
Analysis of the PAF vs. IAF - Air Combat Over the Subcontinent

by M. Hussain

Pakistan and India. Two regional powers, frequently at war, armed to the teeth, possessing nuclear weapons and with no end in sight to their mutual animosity. War in the Subcontinent today has very high stakes. But none higher than in their respective air arms. Given the importance of air combat to modern warfare, a crucial factor to analyze the outcome of any conflict between them becomes analyzing the viability of each air force. For wars today always begin in air combat, and the successor there often has Fate decide in its favor.

The Pakistan Air Force has traditionally been known as one of the most professional air forces in the world. But the 1990s was a tough decade for the PAF and much of their prestige was lost. Pakistan chose to invest in nuclear weapons and diverted resources there. Damaging sanctions against Pakistan also hurt the PAF more than any other armed service. Thus, a decade was lost and PAF was left behind.
The Indian Air Force meanwhile, found the 1990s most fruitful. They progressed in leaps and bounds, as the Indian economy expanded, military equipment from the West and Russia opened up, and the IAF started learning and incorporating Western standards of air combat. Yet, there were times when India's political environment forced itself upon the IAF. Forced to wait for a local replacement for its MiG-21s that has been in development for over 20 years, and forced to abandon purchases because of political interference from within India, the IAF, on the turn of the century, found itself restrained.

Pakistan meanwhile gained momentum. Years of sanctions led to the development of a joint project with China - the JF-17. Unlike the Indian effort, this bore fruit quickly, under the able leadership of the PAF and astute decision making on the part of their military leader Musharraf. And after 9/11, the doors to Western equipment and military aid opened up again. But constant stalling plagued them such that little of concrete and operational value has been inducted. The PAF is nevertheless modernizing, and by 2012 would have caught up with the IAF. With induction in numbers of JF-17s and J-10s by the end of 2009, the PAF will see the gap vis-à-vis the IAF close rapidly.

Yet, in the Winter of 2008/2009, the PAF is yet half-made and the threat of war is thrust upon her. The PAF and IAF are on their highest alert, as the IAF sees its last opportunity to break the PAF, and the PAF holds strong and does not back down. The vital question thus becomes, what will happen if war broke out now? Today? Would the PAF collapse? Such a question cannot be answered without looking carefully at the assets and capabilities of both air forces.

The first salients we notice is that the IAF is far larger, with about 740 combat aircraft versus the PAF's approximate 400 aircraft. We see that the IAF has over 100 FLANKERs that are modernized and top-rate against the PAF's handful of early block F-16As. The IAF fields BVR missiles in platforms ranging from the MiG-21 Bisons to the Su-30 MKI against a PAF which officially does not have BVRs.

Yet, everything is not as it seems. What at first glance seems overwhelming odds against the PAF, on closer examination, do not seem as overwhelming. The IAF has far lower serviceability of its aircraft, their pilot training, as evidenced by recent Red Flag exercises with the US is also not yet up to par with the PAF, their maintenance crews are not as diligent, their mainly Russian/Soviet technology is generally less reliable and less effective than advertised, and a large part of their fleet of MiG-21s and MiG-27s are outdated. PAF aircraft are either of Western stock or Chinese and are far more maintenance friendly. Pakistan has also been upgrading their aircraft massively and have incorporated a complex combination of technology from across the globe – from China to Brazil, from South Africa to the US. PAF also very likely has BVRs that are not advertised of South African and Chinese origin. PAF pilot training is on par with the best in the world, and its maintenance crews are trained on the level of Western maintenance crews. Lastly, fighting an air war over Pakistan gives the PAF a home advantage and makes their radar and SAM infrastructure very relevant.

IAF aircraft are mainly of Soviet/Russian origin and are not designed for easy maintenance. The Soviets designed aircraft for mass production and on the view that combat aircraft would have short lives in a full scale conflict. As such, ease of maintenance was the last item on their mind. Even the latest Indian acquisition of Russian aircraft, the Su-30 MKI is known for being highly maintenance intensive and extremely fragile. Modifications to the FLANKERs have made them even more difficult to maintain – and example being that IAF sometimes faces tire shortages because the increased tonnage of the Indian FLANKERs make their tires burn out very rapidly.
Indian maintenance crews are also not up to par – at least compared to Western air forces. The large number of IAF crashes is indicative of this, one of the highest rates amongst air forces of the world. What compounds this problem is the age of large sections of the Indian fleet which has large numbers of MiG-21s and MiG-27s that are, besides the Bisons, highly outdated and are sometimes referred to as “Flying Coffins” by their pilots. It is no wonder that India has a hard time recruiting and retaining pilots .

Pakistan on the other hand has no problems recruiting pilots – the PAF has one of the highest rejection rates amongst air forces in the world. The PAF also has a better pilot to aircaft ratio than the IAF, meaning it could sustain a greater sortie rate over a protracted conflict. PAF aircraft are also “pimped” in that they have been extensively modified. Thus, while on paper PAF is flying ancient Mirages that were bought second hand from the Australians, when one actually examines any such model, one is surprised at how extensively they have been rebuilt – almost from scratch and the hardware is extremely lethal. Other than the secretive BVR AAMs, the PAF has extensively incorporated the strike element into its Mirages, at a level only matched by the IAF’s Mirage-2000s and Su-30 FLANKERs, and even then, some of the equipment has no IAF equivalent.

Let us also remember than any conflict between the two forces would last a maximum of 2 weeks as neither side has either the logistics or the political will to fight a longer war. This means that the smaller air force can sustain itself on a more equal footing for the briefer period of time.
The IAF’s fleet of MiG-21s are very short legged. the PAF’s F-7s have better ranges and also don’t need to fly as far given that they would be defending. Considering how large the IAF’s fleet of MiG-21, this becomes a rather relevant point. It would be hard to imagine IAF’s MiG-21s being able to sustain a presence over Pakistani airspace. Meanwhile, Pakistani cruise missiles and ballistic missiles are significantly more developed, effective and numerous than their Indian counterparts. This means that many of the forward Indian air bases would effectively be discounted, further compounding the problem for the IAF.
All these factors suggest a far more complex and mixed picture of the balance between the two air forces. To quantify military power in a more concrete way and to see how this balance plays out, let us look at a model of the PAF and the IAF.
Let us consider three main elements - number of aircraft, how valuable each aircraft is in battle and aircraft serviceability. We have the number of aircraft as a given. We assign percentages for serviceability, and assign a value between 0 and 1 for how effective each aircraft is. To get a broadly accurate picture, these numbers do not have to be absolutely accurate, but relatively accurate. The Table below illustrates this model:

click here and scroll down to see the table.

We find the aggregate combat value by multiplying each of the factors and the number of aircraft. As you notice, I have not included factors such as home advantage to the PAF, PAF’s higher pilot ratio or PAF’s better training. I have also not included the short-legged nature of the MiG-21s and India’s likely inability to lose (or risk not losing) their forward air bases, effectively rendering them nonoperational. These factors are more intrinsic and are harder to quantify, so I will leave the reader to judge by how much to upgrade the PAF’s score on these parameters, or discount the IAF’s.

I am assuming that Air-to-Ground capabilities will also be an important aspect as destroying enemy aircraft on the ground or important installations is a significant element of the air war. I therefore am holding higher numbers of effectiveness for aircraft on both sides that otherwise would be completely redundant such as the IAF MiG-27. Of course, Air-to-Air is more important generally but strike missions should also be considered relevant. As such the model is only moderately biased towards air-to-air capabilities.

Conclusion
It would appear that the IAF is still the superior force. And while accounting for the exogenous items in this model would further lower the gap than the massive 37% gap shown in the table, depending on how it is discounted, it is still decidedly in India’s favor. However, given the short nature of any conflict between India and Pakistan, the gap does not lend credibility to India attaining air superiority over Pakistan under any scenario as could be concluded if we took the 82% gap in numbers. The PAF would likely sustain significant causalities but would likely be able to deny the IAF any semblance of air superiority over Pakistan, at least for any conflict lasting up to a few weeks. As long as PAF can deny the IAF air superiority, it can be considered to have done its job and would be ready to pick the pieces up from where it left it in the last conflict over Kargil.

Grande Strategy: Analysis of the PAF vs. IAF - Air Combat Over the Subcontinent



sir some of the points needs to be verified:
1-j10 by 2009 for paf ,how many would that be ,what is the technical details and turnover number for that aircraft.?

2-the paf will catch up with the iaf in 2012 in the current confirguration as stated by the article that is 3 -4 more years what makes the paf think that iaf will be doing nothing in terms of modernasation in these 3 years.

3-russian and soviet technology is less reliable and less effective and that the chinse technology is much better,ok fine on which western technology are the chinse planes designed, what kind of engines,airframe, ammunition does the chinese use and whats the origin ? i think its mostly russian technology.

4-the great red flag exercises what to say i think if the us were not so wary of the flanker they would not have invited the iaf for participation with that particular plane.how do you expect the americans to even acknowledge that someone else other than them can also build a plane.?dosent pakistan already know of the american backstabbing and double standards.

5-paf has better pilots and technical staff thats true it is accepted worldwide

6-pakistan having western aircrafts ok as the things are going in the next 5 years iaf will have majorly israeli and us technology that will be much higher than what the paf will posses.ust think paf is upgrading its f-16 to bloc 52 what if the iaf decides to buy the f-16IN for mrca which f-16 will be a better plane<still i think pakistan will have an advantage because of its experience in handling and iaf will be new to it>still its a matter that paf should bear in mind.

7- incase of a conflict does pakistani leadership have the diplomatic will to deal with india just imagine what happened in kargil, pakistan was woefull in diplomatic conduct in regards to india, what role did paf play there nothing.
so in case of a war its also important how you conduct it.

8- iaf wont conduct airstrikes from its forward bases just consider the range of its flankers and mirages.

9-- in noways do you compare the mirage roses with mirage 2000-09 they belong to complete different generation of fighters.you cannot change the fighter generation by just upgrading it.


now just look as some of IAF shortcomings which the writer missed:-

1--iaf best fighter su30mki are still new and iaf does not have experience in flying sukhois because they always chose mig fighters.
its takes 10-15 years to master such technically advanced jets in that case paf has superiority.

2--
its difficult for iaf to get complete air dominance because of not the paf fighters but better radar techs and g2a sams that would hurt iaf more than paf fighters.

3--the arrival of awacs by pakistan would make iaf vulnerable so they need to target and destroy them first which would be highly improbable.



a very important point that the writer failed to mention is the use of dedicated satellited in future conflict while india is party to the russian GLONASS which can highly help in accurate targetting and better conduction of air strikes.paf still has to catch upto iaf in this regard. the indian space program is highly advancing and if they incorporate someof the elements from their space program into military use it can be really deadly. the indians have the help of both russian and american help in their space program so paf needs to work on that front also quickly.:agree:

thanx
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Latest posts

Back
Top Bottom