None would be able to destroy Bengali culture: PM Hasina

[Black_cats]

Pardon my ignorance but who is trying to destroy Bengali culture?

Pakistan back in 1952 by trying to impose Urdu only as national language. When student protested the occupation force fired at them and killed number of students and injured many others. UN recognizes the sacrifice for the love of Bengali language and declared Feb 21 as international mother language day. PM Hasina said that in a ceremony orgized on Feb 21 for international mother language day.

 

[SABRE]

Bengali culture or Bangladeshi culture?.Could any Bengali from Bangladesh or India explain this.

That's an interesting point. From the little discussions, I have had with Indian Bengalis and my meager interaction with the Bangladeshi Bengalis I have that though on the surface there are similarities the two quite different in terms of culture, religion (of course), & language as well. Minus Dhaka, much of Bangladesh speaks Sylhet dialect, which is not the case in India. I don't think there is any movement for collective identification of Bengalis on both sides. Bengalis from either side can correct me & perhaps shed more light.

 

[Black_cats]

That's an interesting point. From the little discussions, I have had with Indian Bengalis and my meager interaction with the Bangladeshi Bengalis I have that though on the surface there are similarities the two quite different in terms of culture, religion (of course), & language as well. Minus Dhaka, much of Bangladesh speaks Sylhet dialect, which is not the case in India. I don't think there is any movement for collective identification of Bengalis on both sides. Bengalis from either side can correct me & perhaps shed more light.

Bangladeshis speak Sylheti dialect

 

[Pan-Islamic-Pakistan]

Disgusting to blame just Punjabis. I mean there are many Pathans and Sindhis in the army as well.

Many of our guys in East Pakistan were Pukhtoon. It is disingenuous, but this is what happens when you swallow Indian propaganda without thinking.

 

[SABRE]

Pakistan back in 1952 by trying to impose Urdu only as national language. When student protested the occupation force fired at them and killed number of students and injured many others. UN recognizes the sacrifice for the love of Bengali language and declared Feb 21 as international mother language day. PM Hasina said that in a ceremony orgized on Feb 21 for international mother language day.

That was then & she is still beating the drums. I am not trying to be rude here but honestly how much justification do you/they need to establish yourself as a nation-state with its own identity?

As far as Urdu & identity are concerned, unfortunately, we did not have private media in the country & interaction between the two wings was quite minimum (quite shameful), so the awareness of each other's dynamics were quite minimal. Alas! because of this (amongst other things) we, the ordinary West Pakistani population, also never come to see & realize the plight of the East. While the East never came to realize that Urdu was not the language of the West either. If anything it serves as a Lingua Franca. Sindhis didn't cease being Sindhis, Punjabis didn't cease being Punjabis, & so on.

On the other hand, YES there was a strong case of political subversion of the East by the West.

 

[Yankee-stani]

Make no mistake. After the 1965 war with India, Mujib and Co. started peddling this nonsense of giving up Kashmir for peace with India and that Bangalis had no fight with India.

He was a full-on traitor to Pakistan in every sense of the word.

Letting a man like this come to power in Pakistan would have been a disaster. This is why I support Bhutto’s strong stance against him.

Things happened the right way as they should. Any other method would have galvanized other traitors like MQM and ANP.

Pakistani army fought like lions against overwhelming odds and Pakistani leadership secured their return home.

Bhutto recognized Bangladesh at the OIC in Lahore and pushed other Muslim nations to do so to normalize relations.



Is it true what another poster has written about Kazi Nazrul Islam being an idol worshipper, having a Hindu wife, and being a fan of Tagore?

Mujib and Bhutto were both "imbeciles" and "traitors" first lets talk about Bhutto who I understand was a very polarizing political firgure in Pakistan, but did he as Foreign Minister in 1965 sighed the disasterous Tashkent agreement pushed by the Soviet Union and India which gave India a Political victory while we won the war had our boys killed yet this guy who wanted to unseat Ayub Khan and had a rocky relations with him put the country under the bus fast forward to 1970 General Ayub is gone now Bhutto star and his PPP party was growing in popularity while the country was lead by a "Drunkard" General Yahya Khan , I think in 1970 what should have happen we Mujib should have gotten chance yes he was a scumbag but it would save us a lot a pain of 1971 and Indian hegimony which would have started right after 1971 would have been prevented also Mujib and Bhutto would have probably been taken out by the PAF in a coup much earlier than 1977 under Zia Ul Haq

Many of our guys in East Pakistan were Pukhtoon. It is disingenuous, but this is what happens when you swallow Indian propaganda without thinking.

It sad almost 50 years have passed and the true story of the war has been meeddled by few extreme Bengalis and Indians

I was not alive in 1970's. So I cannot form an opinion. I do not know Bhutto or Mujib personally.

Most of us on PDF were born in the 1980s and 1990s very few dudes like @MastanKhan or @Indus Pakistan are on here they were alive or happen to be in their youth when they followed those events in the early 1970s and being that South Asia as a region is pretty young events like 1971 have been passed off and this is a concern as in recent years ((cucks)) in the media and the ((diaspora)) are trying to push the "ebil Pakistan" narrative

 

[MultaniGuy]

Mujib and Bhutto were both "imbeciles" and "traitors" first lets talk about Bhutto who I understand was a very polarizing political firgure in Pakistan, but did he as Foreign Minister in 1965 sighed the disasterous Tashkent agreement pushed by the Soviet Union and India which gave India a Political victory while we won the war had our boys killed yet this guy who wanted to unseat Ayub Khan and had a rocky relations with him put the country under the bus fast forward to 1970 General Ayub is gone now Bhutto star and his PPP party was growing in popularity while the country was lead by a "Drunkard" General Yahya Khan , I think in 1970 what should have happen we Mujib should have gotten chance yes he was a scumbag but it would save us a lot a pain of 1971 and Indian hegimony which would have started right after 1971 would have been prevented also Mujib and Bhutto would have probably been taken out by the PAF in a coup much earlier than 1977 under Zia Ul Haq


It sad almost 50 years have passed and the true story of the war has been meeddled by few extreme Bengalis and Indians



Most of us on PDF were born in the 1980s and 1990s very few dudes like @MastanKhan or @Indus Pakistan are on here they were alive or happen to be in their youth when they followed those events in the early 1970s and being that South Asia as a region is pretty young events like 1971 have been passed off and this is a concern as in recent years ((cucks)) in the media and the ((diaspora)) are trying to push the "ebil Pakistan" narrative

LOL, the new generation of Pakistanis who were born in the 1980's and 1990's do not even know that Pakistan was one country with Bangladesh.

They only know through textbooks. LOL!

Or what is passed down from oral tradition from their elders!

Mujib and Bhutto were both "imbeciles" and "traitors" first lets talk about Bhutto who I understand was a very polarizing political firgure in Pakistan, but did he as Foreign Minister in 1965 sighed the disasterous Tashkent agreement pushed by the Soviet Union and India which gave India a Political victory while we won the war had our boys killed yet this guy who wanted to unseat Ayub Khan and had a rocky relations with him put the country under the bus fast forward to 1970 General Ayub is gone now Bhutto star and his PPP party was growing in popularity while the country was lead by a "Drunkard" General Yahya Khan , I think in 1970 what should have happen we Mujib should have gotten chance yes he was a scumbag but it would save us a lot a pain of 1971 and Indian hegimony which would have started right after 1971 would have been prevented also Mujib and Bhutto would have probably been taken out by the PAF in a coup much earlier than 1977 under Zia Ul Haq


It sad almost 50 years have passed and the true story of the war has been meeddled by few extreme Bengalis and Indians



Most of us on PDF were born in the 1980s and 1990s very few dudes like @MastanKhan or @Indus Pakistan are on here they were alive or happen to be in their youth when they followed those events in the early 1970s and being that South Asia as a region is pretty young events like 1971 have been passed off and this is a concern as in recent years ((cucks)) in the media and the ((diaspora)) are trying to push the "ebil Pakistan" narrative

Exactly it was almost half a century ago.

Most people do not remember what happened.

Though my father who was born in 1945 knows what happened during the 1970s.

Now he is an old man, he is 73 and about to turn 74 years old.

He said what happened was both West and East Pakistan's fault, but mostly West Pakistan's fault.

West Pakistan mismanaged the situation and the Pakistani army were very cruel to the Bangladeshis.

but the Bangladeshis did wrong too with Mukti Bahini.

He also mentioned Cyclone Bhola exacerbated the situation.

Oh well, Bangladesh is an independent country, who cares.

 

[SABRE]

Bangladeshis speak Sylheti dialect

I heard this from an Indian Bengali lady, who has traveled both sides. Sylhet is a small part of BD with distinct language (correct me if I am wrong). So, I don't know what she meant by Sylheti dialect. Whether its the accent & pronunciations or the whole language. Someone from BD can shed better light on this.

 

[Cookie Monster]

It’s reference to the language movement where West Pakistani ruler tried to impose Urdu on Bengali people and students protested on 21st February of 1952 and died. Bengali and Irish are the only group of people in the world who fought for their language.

Due to the sacrifice of Bengali students on 21st feb the day has recognized as international mother language day!!

Except the two things that are being equated here are not at all the same. The Irish language was forcefully suppressed by the British after they invaded/captured and forcefully occupied Ireland. They banned the use of Irish language in its totality...meaning ppl were forbidden to speak/teach/write/publish it. There were punishments handed out to those who were found violating this oppression.

In case of Urdu...it wasn't forced on Bangladeshi ppl as a means to replace Bengali...Bengali wasn't banned. Urdu was an add on...as a national language on top of the existing Bengali. Also it's not like the Bengali ppl were singled out and only they had to learn it. The same happened everywhere in Pak...to Punjabi/Sindhis/Baloch/Pathans/etc. Do u see Punjabi going extinct? What about Sindhi? Or Pushto? All languages are still there. The protests by Bangladeshi ppl against Urdu were not based on any sound logic/reasoning.

U and lots of other Bangladeshi ppl r here speaking English...why is that? Is it to be able to communicate with non Bengali speaking ppl? I don't see u guys up in arms against English...just like that Urdu was to serve that same purpose...it was so ppl of Pakistan could communicate with each other all across the nation.

@Bilal9 posted a speech here from Jinnah
Jinnah's address at Dhaka

Feel free to read it in its entirety...it's enlightening. I'll post just a small piece of it below that is relevant to this conversation.

"It is by that co-operation and that good spirit and goodwill that you will be able not only to preserve Pakistan, which we have achieved but also, make it a great State in the world. Are you now, after having achieved Pakistan, going to destroy it by your own folly? Do you want to build it up? Well then for that purpose there is one essential condition, and it is this complete unity and solidarity amongst ourselves.

But I want to tell you that in our midst there are people financed by foreign agencies who are intent on creating disruption. Their object is to disrupt and sabotage Pakistan. I want you to be on your guard; I want you to be vigilant and not to be taken in by attractive slogans and catchwords. They say that Pakistan Government and the East Bengal Government are out to destroy your language. A bigger falsehood was never uttered by a man. Quite frankly and openly I must tell you that you have got amongst you a few communists and other agents financed by foreign help and if you are not careful, you will be disrupted. The idea that East Bengal should be brought back into the Indian Union is not given up, and it is their aim yet, and I am confident –I am not afraid, but it is better to be vigilant –that those people who still dream of getting back East Bengal into the Indian Union are living in a dream-land."

"Let me now turn to some of the less satisfactory features of the conditions in this province. There is a certain feeling, I am told, in some parts of this province, against non-Bengali Muslims. There has also lately been a certain amount of excitement over the question whether Bengali or Urdu shall be the State language of this province and of Pakistan. In this latter connection, I hear that some discreditable attempts have been made by political opportunities to make a tool of the student community in Dhaka to embarrass the administration
My young friends, students who are present here, Let me tell you as one who has always had love and affection for you, who has served you for ten years faithfully and loyally, let me give you this word of warning: you will be making the greatest mistake if you allow yourself to be exploited by one political party or another. Remember, there has been a revolutionary change. It is our own Government. We are a free, independent and sovereign State. Let us behave and regulate our affairs as free men; we are not suppressed and oppressed under the regime of a foreign domination; we have broken those chains, we have thrown off those shackles. My young friends, I look forward to you as the real makers of Pakistan, do not be exploited and do not be misled. Create amongst yourselves complete unity and solidarity. Set an example of what youth can do. Your main occupation should be –in fairness to yourself, in fairness to your parents, in fairness to the State to devote your attention to your studies. If you fritter away your energies now, you will always regret. After you leave the portals of your universities and colleges taken you, can play your part freely and help yourself and the State. Let me warn you in the clearest term of the dangers that still face Pakistan and your province in particular as I have done already. Having failed to prevent the establishment of Pakistan, thwarted and frustrated by their failure, the enemies of Pakistan have now turned their attention to disrupt the State by creating a split amongst the Muslims of Pakistan. These attempts have taken the shape principally of encouraging provincialism.

As long as you do not throw off this poison in our body politic, you will never be able to weld yourself, mould yourself, galvanize yourself into a real true nation. What we want is not to talk about Bengali, Punjabi, Sindhi, Baluchi, Pathan and so on. They are of course units. But I ask: have you forgotten the lesson that was taught to us thirteen hundred years ago? If I may point out, you are all outsiders here. Who were the original inhabitants of Bengal not those who are now living. So what is the use of saying “we are Bengalis, or Sindhis, or Pathans, or Punjabi”. No, we are Muslims.

Islam has taught us this, and I think you will agree with me that whatever else you may be and whatever you are, you are a Muslim. You belong to a Nation now; you have now carved out a territory, vast territory, it is all yours; it does not belong to a Punjabi or a Sindhi, or a Pathan, or a Bengali; it is yours. You have got your Central Government where several units are represented. Therefore, if you want to build up yourself into a Nation, for God’s sake give up this provincialism. Provincialism has been one of the curses; and so is sectionalism –Shia, Sunni, etc.

It was no concern of our predecessor Government; it was no concern of theirs to worry about it; they were here to carry on the administration, maintain law and order and to carry on their trade and exploit India as much as they could. But now we are in a different position altogether. Now I give you an example. Take America. When it threw off British rule and declared itself independent, how many nations were there? It had many races: Spaniards, French, Germans, Italians, English, Dutch and many more. Well, there they were. They had many difficulties. But mind you, their nations were actually in existence and they were great nations; whereas you had nothing. You have got Pakistan only now. But there a Frenchman could say ‘I am a Frenchman and belong to a great nation’, and so on. But what happened? They understood and they realized their difficulties because they had sense, and within a very short time they solved their problems and destroyed all this sectionalism, and they were able to speak not as a German or a Frenchman or an Englishman or a Spaniard, but as Americans. They spoke in this spirit: ‘I am an American’ and we are Americans’. And so you should think, live and act in terms that your country is Pakistan and you are a Pakistani.

Now I ask you to get rid of this provincialism, because as long as you allow this poison to remain in the body politic of Pakistan, believe me, you will never be a strong nation, and you will never be able to achieve what I wish we could achieve. Please do not think that I do not appreciate the position. Very often it becomes a vicious circle. When you speak to a Bengali, he says: ‘Yes you are right, but the Punjabi is so arrogant’; when you speak to the Punjabi or non-Bengali, he says, ‘Yes but these people do not want us here, they want to get us out’. Now this is a vicious circle, and I do not think anybody can solve this Chinese puzzle. The question is, who is going to be more sensible, more practical, and more statesmanlike and will be rendering the greatest service to Pakistan? So make up your mind and from today put an end to this sectionalism.

About language, as I have already said, this is in order to create disruption amongst the Mussalmans. Your Prime Minister has rightly pointed this out in a recent statement and I am glad that his Government has decided to put down firmly any attempt to disturb the peace of this province by political saboteurs, their agents. Whether Bengali shall be official language of this province is a matter for the elected representatives of the people of this province to decide. I have no doubt that this question shall be decided solely in accordance with the wishes of the inhabitants ‘of this province at the appropriate time."

If u guys still wish to paint it as some sort of oppression...instead of realizing the function Urdu was supposed to serve then that's fine...each person is entitled to an opinion. However a man should stand by his words and therefore by that same logic u guys should also stop learning/reading/writing/speaking English.

 

[Neptune_]

I heard this from an Indian Bengali lady, who has traveled both sides. Sylhet is a small part of BD with distinct language (correct me if I am wrong). So, I don't know what she meant by Sylheti dialect. Whether its the accent & pronunciations or the whole language. Someone from BD can shed better light on this.

If u ever see that idiot Indian lady again pls tell her on my behalf not to talk about something she has little to no knowledge.

 

[SABRE]

If u ever see that idiot Indian lady again pls tell her on my behalf not to talk about something she has little to no knowledge.

Ah! I don't like being rude to people so I'll just find a polite way of correcting her. But that depends on you correcting her here. So, are there any differences in the dialect of Bengali spoken in the two countries?

 

[Nilgiri]

Ah! I don't like being rude to people so I'll just find a polite way of correcting her. But that depends on you correcting her here. So, are there any differences in the dialect of Bengali spoken in the two countries?

It's best to ignore that rabid chetona goon (Neptune) on such matters. He still thinks BAL is the best thing since sliced bread.

@Al-zakir can inform you more about sylheti culture distinction. Or you can search this subforum using word "sylheti" in search bar....it has been talked about already from all perspectives.

Yes their language is not that mutually intelligible with regular Bengali. Their culture and outlook is also very different to Bangals and Ghotis.

 

[Neptune_]

Mujib and Bhutto were both "imbeciles" and "traitors" first lets talk about Bhutto who I understand was a very polarizing political firgure in Pakistan, but did he as Foreign Minister in 1965 sighed the disasterous Tashkent agreement pushed by the Soviet Union and India which gave India a Political victory while we won the war had our boys killed yet this guy who wanted to unseat Ayub Khan and had a rocky relations with him put the country under the bus fast forward to 1970 General Ayub is gone now Bhutto star and his PPP party was growing in popularity while the country was lead by a "Drunkard" General Yahya Khan , I think in 1970 what should have happen we Mujib should have gotten chance yes he was a scumbag but it would save us a lot a pain of 1971 and Indian hegimony which would have started right after 1971 would have been prevented also Mujib and Bhutto would have probably been taken out by the PAF in a coup much earlier than 1977 under Zia Ul Haq


It sad almost 50 years have passed and the true story of the war has been meeddled by few extreme Bengalis and Indians



Most of us on PDF were born in the 1980s and 1990s very few dudes like @MastanKhan or @Indus Pakistan are on here they were alive or happen to be in their youth when they followed those events in the early 1970s and being that South Asia as a region is pretty young events like 1971 have been passed off and this is a concern as in recent years ((cucks)) in the media and the ((diaspora)) are trying to push the "ebil Pakistan" narrative

Bhutto and Pak army were the traitors who didn't handover the power to the rightful ruler of the country.

They didn't do it cuz if they did they wouldn't be able to do the looting they had been doing from East Pakistan since the separation in 47. Furthermore they never considered the people of east Pakistan as their own. That's why they looted resources from east Pakistan, sucked the blood out of the innocent civilians of east Pakistan and used those looted resources to develop west Pakistan.

So, don't talk nonsense about the father of our nation. He saved us from the economic, social and cultural persecution of the West Pakistan regime. We will forever be greatful to him.

 

[UKBengali]

Bhutto and Pak army were the traitors who didn't handover the power to the rightful ruler of the country.

They didn't do it cuz if they did they wouldn't be able do the looting they had been doing from East Pakistan since the separation in 47. Furthermore they never considered the people of east Pakistan as their own. That's why they looted resources from east Pakistan, sucked the blood out of the innocent civilians of east Pakistan and used those looted resources to develop west Pakistan.

So, don't talk nonsense about the father of our nation. He saved us from the economic, social and cultural persecution of the West Pakistan regime. We will forever be greatful to him.

It makes some Pakistanis feel good to somehow try to also blame BD when all the fault was on them for what happened in 1971.

BD just wanted the same rights as rest of Pakistan but that was too much to ask!

 

[Neptune_]

If makes some Pakistanis feel good to somehow try to also blame BD when all the fault was on them for what happened in 1971.

BD just wanted the same rights as rest of Pakistan but that was too much to ask!

I don't blame them bro. They have been fed this propaganda from their childhood. The name Mujib and Bhutto shouldn't even be written in the same sentence. Bhutto was a traitor whereas Mujib is one of the greatest leaders to ever come out of Asia and also the greatest bengali of all time.