Kiwis soft on India’s NSG bid, Turkey backs Pak

[Ryuzaki]

NEW DELHI: While some holdouts like New Zealand seem to be softening their position on India's NSG membership, seeking only a criteria-based process for group expansion and not a one-time exception to any country, Turkey continues to bat for Pakistan, insisting that applications of both India and Pakistan be considered simultaneously.

Adviser to Pakistan's PM on foreign affairs Sartaj Aziz has thanked Turkey for its "principled" position on the issue.

Reports from Vienna, where the NSG met last week to chalk out the agenda for the upcoming plenary, had earlier said that Turkey was among a handful of countries, including New Zealand, Austria, Ireland and South Africa which had opposed membership for India as it had not signed the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty (NPT).

Countries like New Zealand and Austria, following the US diplomatic push which saw secretary of state John Kerry writing to all NSG members asking them to not block the consensus for India's membership, have relented a little and seem willing to work towards a compromise.

Aziz on Wednesday spoke to the foreign ministers of Turkey and Austria, Mevlut Cavusoglu and Sebastian Kurg respectively.


"Adviser thanked Turkish foreign minister Mevlut Cavusoglu for the principled position adopted by Turkey at the Vienna meeting that the membership applications of both India and Pakistan be considered together," Pakistan said in a statement.


Aziz also spoke to Argentina's foreign minister Susana Malcorra to highlight "Pakistan's credentials for NSG membership" and emphasized the importance of a non-discriminatory approach towards NSG expansion to the non-NPT states.


Aziz has declared that Pakistan was sure to get membership on merit if the gates of NSG were opened for India.

He recently spoke with Italian foreign minister Paolo Gentilioni, New Zealand foreign minister Murray McCully and foreign minister of Republic of Korea Yun Byung-se to seek their support. Aziz had earlier spoken over telephone with Russian foreign minister Sergey Lavrov on the issue.

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...book.com&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=TOI

 

[Alpha BeeTee]

It will be one of the worst diplomatic defeats for Pakistan if the Turks and Sinos compromise on the issue in favor of India.Personally,I see this to be very very unlikely.
We are going towards two possible scenarios.Either the upcoming session of 22nd June is going to be delayed to develop a 'consensus' or India will have to officially ditch the aspirations to be in the club after which there will be the usual rants from the Indians..
"We didn't actually need the membership.." ..."Already have the wavier,doesn't matter.." blah blah blah..

 

[Alpha Fighter]

It will be one of the worst diplomatic defeats for Pakistan if the Turks and Sinos compromise on the issue in favor of India.Personally,I see this to be very very unlikely.
We are going towards two possible scenarios.Either the upcoming session of 22nd June is going to be delayed to develop a 'consensus' or India will have to officially ditch the aspirations to be in the club after which there will be the usual rants from the Indians..
"We didn't actually need the membership.." ..."Already have the wavier,doesn't matter.." blah blah blah..

Well it take US to give Stern Warning to both , then only ,
Turkey = Muslims country
China = Nervous / unsecure dueto rising india status.


rest of all other countries is will support to India .....

 

[Jana Assassin]

Turkey may relent during the next few days.... China risks losing its image nd respect on the global stage for supporting a known nuclear proliferation country pakistan gain entry into the NSG

 

[temporary12345]

It will be one of the worst diplomatic defeats for Pakistan if the Turks and Sinos compromise on the issue in favor of India.Personally,I see this to be very very unlikely.
We are going towards two possible scenarios.Either the upcoming session of 22nd June is going to be delayed to develop a 'consensus' or India will have to officially ditch the aspirations to be in the club after which there will be the usual rants from the Indians..
"We didn't actually need the membership.." ..."Already have the wavier,doesn't matter.." blah blah blah..

Actually we don't, and this is an empirical fact. If Pakistan wanted to harm India's interests, it should have lobbied against exception made for India in 2008. Today, India could do everything that a NSG member could do. This seat is more of a prestige issue, rather than one of utility; and you could gauge this by the fact that India is investing much less political capital in this than it invested in getting the waiver.

This is the reason why I think there is higher probability of Turks vetoing it than Chinese (anyway Chinese have withdrawn their "Pakistan also" objection, a couple of days age). Ideally Turkey would not have struck out as sore thumb, but under Erdogan it seem to be on a mission to collect enemies, and this vote would certainly make it one for India. Though India does not lose much by not getting NSG seat, but since India does not have any animus against Turkey and does not expect it to veto, it would certainly be equivalent to showing a red rag to a bull, and I would not be surprised if India take actions that are antithetical to Turkish interests (much higher chances than India taking action against China).


And Pakistan is not getting into NSG. Period. India is not getting in because of its impeccable non-proliferation record (that is more of PR to sell it to small European countries and western population). India is getting in because it is second largest potential market of Nuclear power and US, Russians, French, and Japanese (even Chinese have been bribed) make and would make a whole lot of money by nuclear trade with India. Thus their eagerness to induct India into NSG, not out of some charity or sense of fairness. Inclusion of India strengthens NSG, Pakistan does not, and being an exclusive club, it would not allow dead weight in.

Turkey may relent during the next few days.... China risks losing its image nd respect on the global stage for supporting a known nuclear proliferation country pakistan gain entry into the NSG

China has been successfully bribed and has dropped its insistence on inclusion of Pak. Turkey ,being ruled by Erdogan, has higher chance of acting stupid.

 

[Kyusuibu Honbu]

China has been successfully bribed and has dropped its insistence on inclusion of Pak. Turkey ,being ruled by Erdogan, has higher chance of acting stupid.

Turkey so far being an MCTR member has not protested Indian inclusion.

 

[temporary12345]

Turkey so far being an MCTR member has not protested Indian inclusion.

That was before Erdogan has gone full retard. Placing condition of Pak too getting in is equivalent to saying NO to India. They are not getting in, and India would not accept a proposition of "both should get in" as India already has what it needs from NSG. Why provide parity to Pakistan when it is not needed?

 

[Red Wolf]

This seat is more of a prestige issue

 

[Guynextdoor2]

Turkey so far being an MCTR member has not protested Indian inclusion.

Turkey's problem is not that it supports Pak. As the biggest military power outside US in NATO it thinks it should get the big seats. India is too big and powerful for Turkey to be an important consideration. Plus Erdogan thinks he's the putin of Turkey so he's posturing. This is childish opposition.

It actually is only a prestige issue. With this UNSC seat becomes easily possible.

It will be one of the worst diplomatic defeats for Pakistan if the Turks and Sinos compromise on the issue in favor of India.Personally,I see this to be very very unlikely.
We are going towards two possible scenarios.Either the upcoming session of 22nd June is going to be delayed to develop a 'consensus' or India will have to officially ditch the aspirations to be in the club after which there will be the usual rants from the Indians..
"We didn't actually need the membership.." ..."Already have the wavier,doesn't matter.." blah blah blah..

India six times bigger, 1/5 th of humanity. WHat Pak thinks is unimportant.

 

[weqi]

Well it take US to give Stern Warning to both , then only ,
Turkey = Muslims country
China = Nervous / unsecure dueto rising india status.


rest of all other countries is will support to India .....

your push marketing turned looking pull marketing for pakistan so come up with complete subjet ..............NSG

 

[Kyusuibu Honbu]

Turkey's problem is not that it supports Pak. As the biggest military power outside US in NATO it thinks it should get the big seats. India is too big and powerful for Turkey to be an important consideration. Plus Erdogan thinks he's the putin of Turkey so he's posturing. This is childish opposition.

What you said is absolutely right in regard to Indo-US nuclear deal.

Turkey was overtly disappointed that India received such a deal and Turkey despite being an NPT signatory and NSG member did not.

3. (C) Turkey's refusal thus far to accept new guidelines at the Nuclear Suppliers Group on enrichment technology is shaped largely by three factors:

- its resentment, based largely on nationalist sentiment, that other states (i.e. India, Argentina and Brazil) which have not been loyal NATO allies and NPT members for decades are being granted an exception or an exemption to prohibitions on transfer of enrichment technology;

- its incomplete policy on how Turkey plans to approach nuclear energy and whether it would be wise to close any doors before it develops a coherent policy; and

- lack of leadership at Turkey's Atomic Energy Agency (TAEK).

https://wikileaks.org/plusd/cables/09ANKARA959_a.html

But it makes no sense in case of NSG and MTCR, both of which Turkey is already a member.

 

[Alpha Fighter]

your push marketing turned looking pull marketing for pakistan so come up with complete subjet ..............NSG

India throw a bone and then see them dancing..... lol

 

[Guynextdoor2]

What you said is absolutely right in regard to Indo-US nuclear deal.

Turkey was overtly disappointed that India received such a deal and Turkey despite being an NPT signatory and NSG member did not.

But it makes no sense in case of NSG and MTCR, both of which Turkey is already a member.

Naa...it's not a question of 'becoming member'. There are different kinds of members- those on this high table and the regular guys. Problem is India didn't want to get classified with the likes of Thailand etc. in terms of missile or nuke tech. We now enter the clubs on the high table coz we've proven that neither MTCR nor NSG have had an impact on our tech development in these fields. They HAVE to get us in to get the treaties working.

 

[Red Wolf]

It actually is only a prestige issue. With this UNSC seat becomes easily possible.

If you're connecting this with UNSC, then its all about power.

 

[neem456]

Its a 48 member club.
Lets aassume turkey and china both do not support indias and note negatively, will it defeat the india's attempt still ?
Rest of 46 votes do not matter ?