Japan is struggling to quit floppy disks and fax machines

[beijingwalker]

Japan is struggling to quit floppy disks and fax machines​

BY LUCY CRAFT
SEPTEMBER 13, 2022 / 7:55 AM / CBS NEWS

Tokyo — With its azure ocean views and terraced rice paddies, the city of Hamada, population 50,000, is far from Japan's major urban centers of Tokyo and Osaka. But Hamada is no digital slouch. Just like cities in other advanced nations, Hamada collects taxes, health insurance premiums and social security contributions from residents' bank accounts by sending invoice orders online to local financial institutions.

But in some respects, Hamada's transactions are a throwback to the 20th century. One of eight local banks the city administration does business with insists that payment instructions be handed over physically, on floppy disks. Here's what a floppy disk looks like, for anyone under a certain age:

A file photo shows a woman holding a new Fujifilm 200MB capacity 3.5" floppy disk and drive at the company's office in Tokyo, January 28, 2000.YOSHIKAZU TSUNO/AFP/GETTY

The mylar-coated magnetic disks invented by IBM in 1967 have largely been consigned to museums in the developed world. They fit a mere megabyte of data — enough for a few seconds of video.

"Floppy disk production ended 10 years ago, and we've urged that bank to go online," a spokeswoman for the city's accounting department told CBS News. "But they cling to their old system."

Even some of the banks that have gone digital, she said, still expect all transactions to be confirmed by fax. (If you're not familiar with floppy disks, fax machines are… well, they're even older.)

File photo of a person using a fax machine.ISTOCK/GETTY

But amid the pressure to move into the 21st century, Hamada is not alone. A survey earlier this year by the San-in Chuo Shimpo newspaper found that Hamada was among nine towns in Shimane Prefecture still using floppies. All told, more than half of the localities in Shimane and in neighboring Tottori, both west of Tokyo, still use floppy disks.

The towns' adherence to a half-century-old data storage method reflects the unusual staying power of obsolete technology in Japan. And the Luddism is hardly limited to the far corners of the country.

The Nikkei financial newspaper reported that some of Tokyo's 23 wards are midway through digital conversions, hastened by major banks charging stiff handling fees for hardware-based transactions.

A sales clerk at Seiwa Electric, an appliance shop in western Tokyo packed to the gills with the latest-model refrigerators, washing machines and air conditioners, showed CBS News one of their hottest-selling products: A Panasonic fax machine that retails for $189.

"Seniors love it," she said. "They can order mikan oranges from the farm and use the device to make copies."

The shop still gets plenty of mileage out of its own fax machine, too, because some of its suppliers simply dislike doing business online.

The reluctance to part with old hardware illustrates the obstacles for Japan's Digital Agency, which was established exactly one year ago this month. Led by prime ministerial aspirant and outspoken Digital Minister Taro Kono, the agency is fighting to consign the floppy disk, along with other hardware like CD-ROMs, DVDs and USB drives, to the dustbin.

Kono said a review found close to 2,000 government procedures still require business-related applications to be submitted on floppy disks or other physical media. Among other things, Japan's foot-dragging in the digital shift is hindering adoption of a national digital ID system, and degrading workplace efficiency.

Floppies and other storage hardware remain so pervasive in the world's third-largest economy that they've even featured in some infamous cases, such as last year, when the Tokyo Metropolitan Police lost two floppy disks containing personal data on 38 men who were applying for public housing.

In June, a contractor for the city of Amagasaki, in western Japan, went on an after-work bender. When he came to, on the street, his bag — containing USB flash drives with data on close to half a million residents, including their bank account details — was gone. The USBs turned up later at an apartment complex.

That was shortly after the town of Abu gained notoriety for mistakenly sending its entire COVID relief fund to a 24-year-old resident last spring.

That transfer was sent digitally. But there was a floppy disk backup.

Japan is struggling to quit floppy disks and fax machines

The nation, home to some of the world's biggest technology firms, has a somewhat counterintuitive addiction to the technology of yesteryear.

www.cbsnews.com

 

[Paitoo]

Does it have anything to do with the fact that Japan is an ageing society, where many elderly people are still working and are used to the devices from their youth. Or maybe there is a fondness for old stuff? A mistrust of digital documents? Very strange.

I have noticed in American movies even post 2000, the TVs always seem to be CRT, video cassette players being used, while in India these went extinct in the 90s.

 

[emotionless_teenage]

Does it have anything to do with the fact that Japan is an ageing society, where many elderly people are still working and are used to the devices from their youth. Or maybe there is a fondness for old stuff? A mistrust of digital documents? Very strange.

I have noticed in American movies even post 2000, the TVs always seem to be CRT, video cassette players being used, while in India these went extinct in the 90s.

It's easier to "upgrade" if the existing infrastructure doesn't exist in the first place. It's easy for african countries to go fiber optics because more often than not there's no legacy equipment to upgrade so they just buy new unlike in America where the process to replace copper cabling would take years and hundreds of billions of dollars. Also It's easy to buy flat screen TV if it's the first TV you owned whereas it's going to be harder for yo average american to upgrade to flat screen TV if the CRT is working just fine especially if it's a high end Sony Trinitron TV.

You don't want to replace 20 y.o CNC machine with a new one just because said CNC machine store instructions on floppy disk. Similarly upgrading the machine would take precious manufacturing time as well as bugs to be ironed out that also cost money

 

[cybertron]

When I tell younger generations about floppy disks and they have no idea what it means - really makes me feel old!!

 

[Paitoo]

In early 2000s, my job involved a lot of use of fax machine. The reason was a peculiar one. My biggest client (a Singporean) was a luddite of some sort and anti computers and email. His office was a small room that consisted of only typewriter and fax machine. So every time he communicated with me, he would type a letter (in the old formal way), and then fax it. He didn't use mobile phones either. You could call him only during business hours on landline.

 

[beijingwalker]

There are lots of legacy tech that Japanese hold so dear to and are reluctant to let go.

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[Menthol]

You see, that's why Japan is lagging.

Well, maybe the entire East Asia and future China.

East Asian are adaptive and conformist, they prefer to beat their own mentality to get the job done, despite how bothersome and tiresome it is.

Instead of being innovative and creative, and use their additional energy and time to do something else.

They look hardworking but definitely not smart.


Me, I already use Whatsapp, Zoom, to send documents and organize the entire management.

Maybe I look like a lazy person, but I get a lot of jobs done in a day, in a week, in a month than perhaps most people.


Btw, I am also quite amazed how people in USA are still using SMS to send messages.

 

[beijingwalker]

You see, that's why Japan is lagging.

Well, maybe the entire East Asia and future China.

East Asian are adaptive and conformist, they prefer to beat their own mentality to get the job done, despite how bothersome and tiresome it is.

Instead of being innovative and creative, and use their additional energy and time to do something else.

They look hardworking but definitely not smart.


Me, I already use Whatsapp, Zoom, to send documents and organize the entire management.

Maybe I look like a lazy person, but I get a lot of jobs done in a day, in a week, in a month than perhaps most people.


Btw, I am also quite amazed how people in USA are still using SMS to send messages.

Wrong, refusing to let go of legacy tech is Japanese and Americans, not Chinese.

 

[MH.Yang]

Does it have anything to do with the fact that Japan is an ageing society, where many elderly people are still working and are used to the devices from their youth. Or maybe there is a fondness for old stuff? A mistrust of digital documents? Very strange.

I have noticed in American movies even post 2000, the TVs always seem to be CRT, video cassette players being used, while in India these went extinct in the 90s.

You see, that's why Japan is lagging.

Well, maybe the entire East Asia and future China.

East Asian are adaptive and conformist, they prefer to beat their own mentality to get the job done, despite how bothersome and tiresome it is.

Instead of being innovative and creative, and use their additional energy and time to do something else.

They look hardworking but definitely not smart.


Me, I already use Whatsapp, Zoom, to send documents and organize the entire management.

Maybe I look like a lazy person, but I get a lot of jobs done in a day, in a week, in a month than perhaps most people.


Btw, I am also quite amazed how people in USA are still using SMS to send messages.

This has nothing to do with the aging of Japanese society, but with Japanese corporate culture. Physical rigidity, extreme emphasis on qualifications, serious hierarchical differentiation, conservative and lack of initiative.

 

[Enigma SIG]

So how about the world mails them revenues for their worldwide operations (cars, entertainment) on floppies.
Through a boat.
That takes 60 days to reach Japan.
That needs to be confirmed through them shipping the floppies back after approval.

Pretty sure that'll change them quick lmao.

 

[Paitoo]

This has nothing to do with the aging of Japanese society, but with Japanese corporate culture. Physical rigidity, extreme emphasis on qualifications, serious hierarchical differentiation, conservative and lack of initiative.

In my previous company we were trying to crack a deal with a Japanese client. It was extremely difficult as they needed a dedicated relationship manager on site, who should be Japanese and we could not afford it just for one client, mainly because he/she wouldn't have enough work. Finally we did agree, but the contract didn't last. The local employee himself was very unfamiliar with our style of working and was constantly getting into arguments with our team here. We Indians are not unfamiliar with hierarchy and rigidity and can adapt to it, but even for us it was not worth the constant heartache. Interestingly, he was very demanding of our team here but was reluctant to work outside office hours himself. Our product, while not exceptional, was good enough for American clients, but the Japanese constantly wanted fixes for the smallest things and used to get upset fairly quick.

 

[MH.Yang]

In my previous company we were trying to crack a deal with a Japanese client. It was extremely difficult as they needed a dedicated relationship manager on site, who should be Japanese and we could not afford it just for one client, mainly because he/she wouldn't have enough work. Finally we did agree, but the contract didn't last. The local employee himself was very unfamiliar with our style of working and was constantly getting into arguments with our team here. We Indians are not unfamiliar with hierarchy and rigidity and can adapt to it, but even for us it was not worth the constant heartache. Interestingly, he was very demanding of our team here but was reluctant to work outside office hours himself. Our product, while not exceptional, was good enough for American clients, but the Japanese constantly wanted fixes for the smallest things and used to get upset fairly quick.

Japanese companies usually do not fire their employees, but they will limit their wages. So don't expect employees to have too much enthusiasm. Enterprises pay more attention to the qualifications of employees than to their abilities. Moreover, Japanese culture excludes and discriminates against foreigners.

 

[Foinikas]

You got something against floppy disks?

 

[313ghazi]

Unbelievable. I can't remember the last time I saw a floppy disk.

 

[Han Patriot]

You see, that's why Japan is lagging.

Well, maybe the entire East Asia and future China.

East Asian are adaptive and conformist, they prefer to beat their own mentality to get the job done, despite how bothersome and tiresome it is.

Instead of being innovative and creative, and use their additional energy and time to do something else.

They look hardworking but definitely not smart.


Me, I already use Whatsapp, Zoom, to send documents and organize the entire management.

Maybe I look like a lazy person, but I get a lot of jobs done in a day, in a week, in a month than perhaps most people.


Btw, I am also quite amazed how people in USA are still using SMS to send messages.

You are pretty wrong on this mate. Chinese like to always work smart and optimize and do short cuts sometimes to the detriment in maintaining standards. I am not talking about your average factory worker or farmer. I am talking about engineers and technocrats, they are not conformist they only conform to hierarchy not work method. I have seen some pretty I genius ways of doing things to save time and cost but not standards abiding.