Iranian Ground Forces | News and Equipment

[TheImmortal]

Atleast this whole situation might cause an acceleration of funding towards ground forces.

Unlikely. Iran still embraces martyrdom way too much. Thus modernization of cannon fodder..I mean artesh....is not on the horizon due to non existent threat of a ground war and lack of funding. Until Iranian economy recovers and coffers start filling up again and certain other fields get sufficient funding that have priority (like Navy), ground forces will look ancient.

 

[Muhammed45]

Unlikely. Iran still embraces martyrdom way too much. Thus modernization of cannon fodder..I mean artesh....is not on the horizon due to non existent threat of a ground war and lack of funding. Until Iranian economy recovers and coffers start filling up again and certain other fields get sufficient funding that have priority (like Navy), ground forces will look ancient.

Chieftain is the most accurate Tank in the world. Upgrading this Tank with new engines was a great experience to be used in Karrar.

 

[TheImmortal]

Chieftain is the most accurate Tank in the world. Upgrading this Tank with new engines was a great experience to be used in Karrar.

The current upgrade is still lacking. No automated gunner, no APS, no IR jammer (that I could see) with turret auto detection and fire mechanism on an enemy lasing the tank.

But my comments weren’t really about the tanks Iran has. More the lack of modern APCs, IFVs, body armour, and overall modernization of iran’s soldiers and equipment.

Iran’s tanks are not cutting edge, but they can be upgraded over time or replaced with a next gen tank (no need to rush )

 

[khanasifm]

?

https://twitter.com/x/status/1444386094150262797

 

[Stryker1982]

?

https://twitter.com/x/status/1444386094150262797

Their are two different types of wars...twitter wars and real wars.

Their is no source for this, and thereagex is also the same person who said Iran will launch 4000 ballistic missiles to destroy Baku....fake news.

 

[sha ah]

Chieftains are really third tier Iranian tanks. First you have the Karrar (T-90 equivalent), then modernized T-72s, then Chieftains along with T-55/60 upgraded tanks. Or you could even argue that the T-55/60 upgrades are better since they have reactive armor? So Chieftains are pretty much 4th tier Iranian tanks. The only tanks worse than that are the few remaining M-60's Iran has left over. I believe a handful have been modernized ? Turkey has lots of M-60s though.

Iranian tanks in order or priority. Karrar (T-90), T-72, T-55/60, Chieftain, M-60

The current upgrade is still lacking. No automated gunner, no APS, no IR jammer (that I could see) with turret auto detection and fire mechanism on an enemy lasing the tank.

But my comments weren’t really about the tanks Iran has. More the lack of modern APCs, IFVs, body armour, and overall modernization of iran’s soldiers and equipment.

Iran’s tanks are not cutting edge, but they can be upgraded over time or replaced with a next gen tank (no need to rush )

 

[Stryker1982]

Unlikely. Iran still embraces martyrdom way too much. Thus modernization of cannon fodder..I mean artesh....is not on the horizon due to non existent threat of a ground war and lack of funding. Until Iranian economy recovers and coffers start filling up again and certain other fields get sufficient funding that have priority (like Navy), ground forces will look ancient.

I think this is overstated...the main reason for non-modernization of the ground forces is lack of priorities and funding.

If the main threat is no longer the USAF or IAF, and the main threat is on the ground, then I should expect to see doctrine and priority to change accordingly especially if the coffer start filling up again when about 100 billion dollars are funds are freed in the event of some sort of deal.

Just saw today that Iran is asking for 10$ billion to be freed as a precursor to negotiate. This is important for curbing inflation among other issues.

 

[sha ah]

Realistically I don't see that deal happening. Biden is demanding a "better and stronger" nuclear deal. That's a no go for Iran. In any case Iran's economy is growing anyways and Iran is exporting a decent amount of energy right now. I really don't see the army having a lack of funding. It's just the pace at which they're progressing considering the threats they're facing. Iran's priorities are simply not in infantry attack vehicles or tanks. Yes it's still a significant field of interest for Iran but not anything like air defenses/missiles or the recent proliferation of drones/uav technology.

I think this is overstated...the main reason for non-modernization of the ground forces is lack of priorities and funding.

If the main threat is no longer the USAF or IAF, and the main threat is on the ground, then I should expect to see doctrine and priority to change accordingly especially if the coffer start filling up again when about 100 billion dollars are funds are freed in the event of some sort of deal.

Just saw today that Iran is asking for 10$ billion to be freed as a precursor to negotiate. This is important for curbing inflation among other issues.

 

[Stryker1982]

Realistically I don't see that deal happening. Biden is demanding a "better and stronger" nuclear deal. That's a no go for Iran. In any case Iran's economy is growing anyways and Iran is exporting a decent amount of energy right now. I really don't see the army having a lack of funding. It's just the pace at which they're progressing considering the threats they're facing. Iran's priorities are simply not in infantry attack vehicles or tanks. Yes it's still a significant field of interest for Iran but not anything like air defenses/missiles or the recent proliferation of drones/uav technology.

The army has a lack of budget, I don't know what you are talking about, the army has been facing budget cuts for years and their isn't enough extra funds for a serious modernization program. Plain and simple.

And no, the economy is shit, and their is massive inflation all across the board.

 

[TheImmortal]

I think this is overstated...the main reason for non-modernization of the ground forces is lack of priorities and funding.

If the main threat is no longer the USAF or IAF, and the main threat is on the ground, then I should expect to see doctrine and priority to change accordingly especially if the coffer start filling up again when about 100 billion dollars are funds are freed in the event of some sort of deal.

Just saw today that Iran is asking for 10$ billion to be freed as a precursor to negotiate. This is important for curbing inflation among other issues.

The army has a lack of budget, I don't know what you are talking about, the army has been facing budget cuts for years and their isn't enough extra funds for a serious modernization program. Plain and simple.

And no, the economy is shit, and their is massive inflation all across the board.

You act like Iran doesn’t have other bills to pay. That $100B will likely get eaten up paying off various lines of credit and putting it towards investments into various economic/social/state projects. With the rest having to be kept on hand as reserves to protect the state in case of emergency. (Go see how fast Assad burned thru his reserves in an emergency).

On top of that. As long as IRGC dominates 80% of the military budget then Artesh will continue to get breadcrumbs. Furthermore, when will the threat of ground game become reality?

There is no US politician that will sanction a pre-emptive ground invasion of Iran, which would require likely a 1M soldiers or more to secure the wider Middle East in such a event.

Thus there is likely NO scenario where ground invasion is a reality. Thus mechanized armour and ground forces will get last priority over Missiles, Missile Defense, Navy, EW, and even Air Force.

The most sustainable way to see true modernization of armed forces is by growing the economy by at least 100%, which at that point the Defense spending % of GDP will naturally rise. That is how India and China have modernized their forces. A 300B economy (Iran’s current state) is a joke. No reason Iran shouldn’t have the same economic size as a South Korea or Japan given its population size, natural resources, and diverse economic sectors.

 

[Stryker1982]

You act like Iran doesn’t have other bills to pay. That $100B will likely get eaten up paying off various lines of credit and putting it towards investments into various economic/social/state projects. With the rest having to be kept on hand as reserves to protect the state in case of emergency. (Go see how fast Assad burned thru his reserves in an emergency).

On top of that. As long as IRGC dominates 80% of the military budget then Artesh will continue to get breadcrumbs. Furthermore, when will the threat of ground game become reality?

There is no US politician that will sanction a pre-emptive ground invasion of Iran, which would require likely a 1M soldiers or more to secure the wider Middle East in such a event.

Thus there is likely NO scenario where ground invasion is a reality. Thus mechanized armour and ground forces will get last priority over Missiles, Missile Defense, Navy, EW, and even Air Force.

Did I say that 100 billion dollars will go straight to the military? Can you explain to me where I said that? Stop making assumptions...., you always angrily act like this.

I am not going to say how free funds would be used, but it's pretty rational to suggest that freed funds will be used for all sorts of projects all over the country, and logically some of which can be used to increase the budget of the Artesh, or extend emergency funding for important programs that have been sitting on the shelf. Overall GDP can rise, inflation can be curbed and improvement in the economic conditions of the country would ideally be seen. That is literally all I am saying.

Why are you talking about the US? No one is talking about the US here. Their is for the foreseeable future, major ground tensions with Turkey and Azerbaijan. That is the possible scenario for a ground clash, and will only get worse as Turkey is adamant about this corridor. Be sure they will look to cause trouble, probably by moving militants from Idlib to Nakhichevan in the event that Russia and Syria attacks Idlib by winter as Putin stated.
The prospect that has been mentioned many times by officials is Israel's expansion over military relations with Azerbaijan. Think 10 years from now. We won't be surprised if Israel provides them with an export version of the Merkava, among other military equipment that would complicate things much more. They know this is going to happen and only going to expand further. The situation with the ground forces can't be ignored forever.

The most sustainable way to see true modernization of armed forces is by growing the economy by at least 100%, which at that point the Defense spending % of GDP will naturally rise. That is how India and China have modernized their forces. A 300B economy (Iran’s current state) is a joke. No reason Iran shouldn’t have the same economic size as a South Korea or Japan given its population size, natural resources, and diverse economic sectors.

Ideally. I'd like to see this but I'm not optimistic.

 

[sha ah]

There may have been budget cuts for the military in recent years when Iran's economy was shrinking, especially after 2018 when Trump left the nuclear deal. However at the moment Iran's economy is growing and Iran's oil sales are pre sanctions levels. At the moment Iran's military budget is far larger than what is officially stated. Many analysts believe it's actually something close to the 20 billion range.

As far as procuring what Iran needs for its own defense, that's not too much of an issue right now. Just look at the air defense department for example. Turkey just paid Russia another several billion for another S-400 battery, risking more sanctions from the west, while the Turkish currency is crashing and at an all time low.

Meanwhile Iran can build something like Bavar 373, or last I heard an even better variant, which is more or less on par with the S-400. Even if it's a little less capable than the S-400, Iran can produce them at a fraction of the cost. Iran can produce more of them over the years and doesn't require another nation to import them in case of a conflict.

So let's assume that Israel gives Azerbaijan the export variant of Merkava. Didn't Hezbollah blow the Israeli variants of Merkava to pieces in 2006 ?

Also it doesn't matter if Erdogan puts militants in Nakhchivan. Iran's border stretches all across Nakhchivan. Turkey only has access via a small, winding, mountain road. Again by Soviet design, it's basically a choke point, a death trap for them. Good let them send more militants there. The more the better. It's an isolated enclave.

Iran doesn't care so much about a Turkish corridor, as long as Iran has access to Armenia. It's not even about economic benefits per say because doing business with Azerbaijan is probably more profitable for Iran. It's the principle and the threat they're posing towards Iranian Azerbaijan as per their future goals. I believe Iran should build a small diversion along the highway or perhaps an underground tunnel that goes directly to Yerevan ? Or perhaps charge or seize their truck drivers or fishermen to teach them a lesson. Iran has to weight it's options here.

Did I say that 100 billion dollars will go straight to the military? Can you explain to me where I said that? Stop making assumptions...., you always angrily act like this.

I am not going to say how free funds would be used, but it's pretty rational to suggest that freed funds will be used for all sorts of projects all over the country, and logically some of which can be used to increase the budget of the Artesh, or extend emergency funding for important programs that have been sitting on the shelf. Overall GDP can rise, inflation can be curbed and improvement in the economic conditions of the country would ideally be seen. That is literally all I am saying.

Why are you talking about the US? No one is talking about the US here. Their is for the foreseeable future, major ground tensions with Turkey and Azerbaijan. That is the possible scenario for a ground clash, and will only get worse as Turkey is adamant about this corridor. Be sure they will look to cause trouble, probably by moving militants from Idlib to Nakhichevan in the event that Russia and Syria attacks Idlib by winter as Putin stated.
The prospect that has been mentioned many times by officials is Israel's expansion over military relations with Azerbaijan. Think 10 years from now. We won't be surprised if Israel provides them with an export version of the Merkava, among other military equipment that would complicate things much more. They know this is going to happen and only going to expand further. The situation with the ground forces can't be ignored forever.




Ideally. I'd like to see this but I'm not optimistic.

 

[Mr Iran Eye]

It is true and I have always said that Iran has a secret budget for the military. Budget is higher than mentioned by Global Firepower

You have to look at all the different vehicles to see that Iran has a powerful mechanized army. It is clear that they have a lot more tanks than they officially present to us.

 

[reflecthofgeismar]

"..."

Nah dude, just NAH.

Upgrade all your T-72S to Karrar standard (1 chassis).
Upgrade all your BMP-2 with Iranian produced Kornet and (murrican inspired MK 19 Mod 3) 40x53mm AGL and space and cage armor to BMP-2M standard (there are several "M"-variants).
Upgrade all your already upgraded BTR-60PPB to a more modern standard, best would be exactly modernized BMP-2 turret and give them a new 8x8 gun variant - 105mm turrets, like the Cubans gave their 100mm turrets from T-54B/T-55A (a bit modified).
For mobile artillery, use only 8x8 or 10x10 chassis, armored, 12.7x108mm RCWS.

Just use FEWER chassis, much easier to produce, to maintain, a lot cheaper even if the products are from higher quality.
Greetings!

 

[sha ah]

Iran has done alot when it comes to maintenance and modernization of its various equipment. However there is still more work to be done obviously and progress is ongoing.

Before 1979 Iran bought weapons exclusively from the west. After 1979 Iran for a time couldn't buy weapons from anyone, then had to buy a combination of whatever they could get their hands on, especially in the 80's during the Iran-Iraq war.

As a result Iran has far too many different kinds of fighter jets in inventory and far too many kind of tanks for example. Despite these issues Iran's military are extremely resourceful and have done a good job keeping everything in order.

In the coming 2 decades some older tanks and infantry vehicles must be phased out and especially fighter jets like the F-4, they have to be phased out.

In many sectors Iran is mostly self sufficient. When it comes to ground vehicles, or air defenses for example, Iran seems to be more or less good on its own. Fighter jets, Iran has some options, however Iran's military leaders are picky and want to make sure they get their hands on a solid platform. Iran's military are more concerned about purchasing a proven platform and getting value out of their purchase rather than simply investing in hype.

For example, Iran could have purchased the S-400 instead of S-300. If you recall the initial deal was delayed for a very long time. The issue is that when it comes to the S-400, the Russians do not give out the source codes.

Turkey for example does not have the sources codes for the S-400 and some maintenance has to be done by Russian technicians. The latest export variant of the S-300 Iran ended up purchasing is a different story. Iran has the source codes and can do all the maintenance on their own.

Yes the S-400 export variant is slightly better than the last S-300 export variant but we saw how under Israeli pressure the Russians would not even give the Syrians the source codes for the S-300, which ended up being a stumbling block and headache for Syria.

At the end of the day, self sufficiency and depending on proven, cost effective technology are key factors for Iran's military.

Nah dude, just NAH.

Upgrade all your T-72S to Karrar standard (1 chassis).
Upgrade all your BMP-2 with Iranian produced Kornet and (murrican inspired MK 19 Mod 3) 40x53mm AGL and space and cage armor to BMP-2M standard (there are several "M"-variants).
Upgrade all your already upgraded BTR-60PPB to a more modern standard, best would be exactly modernized BMP-2 turret and give them a new 8x8 gun variant - 105mm turrets, like the Cubans gave their 100mm turrets from T-54B/T-55A (a bit modified).
For mobile artillery, use only 8x8 or 10x10 chassis, armored, 12.7x108mm RCWS.

Just use FEWER chassis, much easier to produce, to maintain, a lot cheaper even if the products are from higher quality.
Greetings!