Iran: Purchase of Russian Su-30 fighters on agenda

[AmirPatriot]

So Mr Babak taghvaee has disappeared now? No rumors out of him recently. Very quiet on this su-30SM issue now.

He's too busy masturbating at whatever Reza Pahlavi says.

 

[Blue In Green]

Hey Russians sell Iran like 500 planes then not deliver them for 10 years because dumb sanctions or whatever.

 

[mohsen]

@mohsen
JCPOA , hero of dipffffffffffflomacy. By giving everything left of military-space-nuclear programs away, the guy is called hero .
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If they were hero, then this guy shall be hero of heros, who gave 40% of Iran's territory away to colonialists.
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I don't know if i have read this somewhere or a great person has stated this, but what i remember of it :
"A nation who doesn't read and learn from history, has to experience all of their past mistakes and learn again and again and again non stop".

Their names and their pathetic statues will be archived as the dark section of our history, along the rest of traitors.

@VEVAK is right. We have to develop our own version of fighter jet. It was close to unveil light turbofan engines, but it is delayed like other military projects. No idea what is going on between current governors, but surely we will get rid of these folks before completely losing of IRGC/Artesh's military structures and equipment. Hero of diplomacy has some plans, may Allah help us.

I'm glad that we can't buy this aircraft, it's just a waste of precious resources.

most important advantage of developing a domestic aircraft is the research opportunity which it gives to our students and scientists.

 

[VEVAK]

The problem is that with the Iranian Rial continuously falling in value, the shape of the military will become worse and worse. Our currency has gotten butchered.

They did the same with Russian currency, reason is the same.

We are in Syria, solution is an independent economy which is not based on selling crude oil. They gave nuclear program away and instead received the same fked up economy. Shame but i think that these sanctions can finally force us to develop a non-oily economy based on foreign exports.

The ONLY way for Iran to truly develop a NONE oil economy is to 1st develop a Tourist industry and without a tourist industry to bring in foreigners and foreign currency there is absolutely no way (Short of starting slavery) Iranian products could ever hope to compete globally! Which is exactly what Turkey has done and today without Oil Turkey has an economy twice the size of Iran's with about the same population!

ANYONE THAT THINKS IRAN CAN HAVE HEJAB BY FORCE & OTHER DELUDED RELIGOUS POLICIES AND A HEALTHY NONE OIL ECONOMY IS DELUSIONAL!!!!!!!!!!!!

Turkey's GDP (nominal) today is $850 Billion USD with a population of 82 Million VS Iran's GDP (Nominal) of $425 Billion USD & a population of ~81 Million!

We have lots of Oil & Natural Gas where as they do NOT and they have a lot of Tourist where as we DO NOT!

Policies like Hejab by force has and will continue to destroy Iran's Economy!

Their names and their pathetic statues will be archived as the dark section of our history, along the rest of traitors.


I'm glad that we can't buy this aircraft, it's just a waste of precious resources.

most important advantage of developing a domestic aircraft is the research opportunity which it gives to our students and scientists.

You're wrong in a country the size of Iran we should have spent at least $2 Billion USD per year every year on new acquisitions for the Air Force ($2Billion for today's prices) in the past 3 decades to upgrade our Air Force now if your capable of producing your own aircraft clearly that's a better option because the money gets recycled into your own economy but at the end of the day that money needs to be spent on adding new aircrafts & equipment to the Air Force for the protection of the country!

When a government isn't doing it's duty then you have to ask where that money going!

And research is useless if you can't turn it into a product that you can improve upon! Today those so called researchers and scientists you speak of are working for U.S. Jet Propulsion Laboratories rather than working toward building various types of civilian and military aircrafts for Iran! And the MAIN PEOPEL TO BLAME are the people that failed to invest in those researchers and scientist!

 

[AmirPatriot]

most important advantage of developing a domestic aircraft is the research opportunity which it gives to our students and scientists.

The most advanced aircraft we ever made is an F-5 with twin tails. 1950s tech. We cannot jump from 1950s light fighter to 21st century 4.5/5th gen fighter in any meaningful timeframe. The region is militarising very rapidly and our air force is far, far behind. Developing, testing and manufacturing (in numbers) any fighter aircraft especially for an inexperienced country like Iran takes a lot of time, time we do not have.

 

[agarrao a las kalandrakas]

You (Iran) has made a lot of progess maintaining and overhauling and upgrading several aircrafts, as F-14 for example.

It's very naive thinking Iran has been able to fly its Tomcats for 40 years with a TOTAL tech blockade only by CANIBALIZATION.
F-14 is a EXTREMELY EXTREMELY COMPLEX aircraft. It's not possible "only" with canibalization.
What about iranian Tomcats sounding "strange" in the outskirts of an airbase? I read something about it in IMF time ago. TF-30 (and family) has a VERY particular sound. If engine changes, sound changes also.

I'm sure Iran has some secrets projects in the branch of aeronautics. Time will tell.

 

[mohsen]

The most advanced aircraft we ever made is an F-5 with twin tails. 1950s tech. We cannot jump from 1950s light fighter to 21st century 4.5/5th gen fighter in any meaningful timeframe. The region is militarising very rapidly and our air force is far, far behind. Developing, testing and manufacturing (in numbers) any fighter aircraft especially for an inexperienced country like Iran takes a lot of time, time we do not have.

Jump from 1950 to 2018?!
Yeah right, 1950 tech is building Bavar 373!

Nonetheless, our strategists were wise enough to realize neither air force is a game changing factor, nor dependency on foreign products can maintain our security (as we have seen both it in yemen-Saudi Arabia war)

 

[AmirPatriot]

Yeah right, 1950 tech is building Bavar 373!

Of course not. But air defence tech is very, very (very) different to jet fighter tech.

Nonetheless, our strategists were wise enough to realize neither air force is a game changing factor

Powerful air forces remain among the biggest force multipliers in militaries today, which is why many countries are willing to spend so much on them.

 

[Tokhme khar]

ok mohsen, then lets become jonvar zameeni now. Hand out tofang to shotur and see him perform miracles in arabistan........flying and AF only for hillbillies and yahudi?.....lol

Jump from 1950 to 2018?!
Yeah right, 1950 tech is building Bavar 373!

Nonetheless, our strategists were wise enough to realize neither air force is a game changing factor, nor dependency on foreign products can maintain our security (as we have seen both it in yemen-Saudi Arabia war)

 

[mohsen]

Of course not. But air defence tech is very, very (very) different to jet fighter tech.



Powerful air forces remain among the biggest force multipliers in militaries today, which is why many countries are willing to spend so much on them.

Bavar was just an example, a coutry which has the capability to produce an AESA radar for ground unites, can produce a radar for it's fighters too, the same with missiles.
That's how Qaher emerged, and if it's not flying today, it's only because of some f@cks who also received their medal!

It's a force multiplier only if enemy can't counter it, and yet what did this force achieved in Yemen, except killing civilians?!

ok mohsen, then lets become jonvar zameeni now. Hand out tofang to shotur and see him perform miracles in arabistan........flying and AF only for hillbillies and yahudi?.....lol

You do that, I develop air defense and ballistic missiles, see if flying shutors can do a damn thing.

 

[AmirPatriot]

Bavar was just an example, a coutry which has the capability to produce an AESA radar for ground unites, can produce a radar for it's fighters too, the same with missiles.

1. Fighter aircraft are a lot more than just radars. Engines, airframe, avionics, stealth etc.

2. Miniaturisation of AESA technology is not easy.

It's a force multiplier only if enemy can't counter it, and yet what did this force achieved in Yemen, except killing civilians?!

Just because an enemy can counter your capability, doesn't mean you don't develop it to try and overcome the counters. Iran still has ballistic missiles even though our enemies have ABM, we have air defence even though our enemies have anti-radiation missiles.

As for what can an air force achieve, I don't need to list how many examples of this there are, but one example ist he successful Russian airpower in Syria.

 

[mohsen]

Just because an enemy can counter your capability, doesn't mean you don't develop it to try and overcome the counters. Iran still has ballistic missiles even though our enemies have ABM, we have air defence even though our enemies have anti-radiation missiles.

Just because an enemy has developed a capability it doesn't mean we have to counter it using the same capability (symmetrically), they choose a tactic, a tool, cause they think they are better in it, refusing to acknowledge it is called stubbornness and is equal to defeat.

even if we had the F22 technology, we still wouldn't count on it against U.S, their budget is tens of times higher, they can afford any loose, we can't.

As for what can an air force achieve, I don't need to list how many examples of this there are, but one example ist he successful Russian airpower in Syria.

amount of Russian's success in Syria is in question, specially when the defeated ones only blame Iran and not Russia, afterall this is the same air power (weaker actually) which once failed against similar rebels, remember?

but I can mention other example of unsuccessful cases against those who didn't limit themselves to conventional war theories, and the legendary one was Israel against Hizbollah.

 

[AmirPatriot]

Just because an enemy has developed a capability it doesn't mean we have to counter it using the same capability (symmetrically), they choose a tactic, a tool, cause they think they are better in it, refusing to acknowledge it is called stubbornness and is equal to defeat.

The whole world is using combat aircraft as a major part of their military. So the entire world's collective strategists, be they American, European, Russian or Chinese must all be immensely stupid and stubborn.

amount of Russian's success in Syria is in question

Since they've come in, the Syrian war has made a decisive turn towards victory.

 

[Tokhme khar]

lol........mohsen jan, time for namaz, then doa barae parvardegar, and then we continue playing with shotur ba tofang........lol. Lets also pray for rain........kheli khoshk hasteen these days in Iran.

I'm sure doa gonna work this time around......lol

Just because an enemy has developed a capability it doesn't mean we have to counter it using the same capability (symmetrically), they choose a tactic, a tool, cause they think they are better in it, refusing to acknowledge it is called stubbornness and is equal to defeat.

even if we had the F22 technology, we still wouldn't count on it against U.S, their budget is tens of times higher, they can afford any loose, we can't.



amount of Russian's success in Syria is in question, specially when the defeated ones only blame Iran and not Russia, afterall this is the same air power (weaker actually) which once failed against similar rebels, remember?

but I can mention other example of unsuccessful cases against those who didn't limit themselves to conventional war theories, and the legendary one was Israel against Hizbollah.

 

[sanel1412]

Under the JCPOA & current weapons embargos against Iran, the country will NOT be allowed to purchase Su-30's till 2023 that's another 5 years from now...

And that's if Russia agrees to co-production rights inside Iran (Which is what current Iranian law requires) and that's if Iran agrees to pay whatever it is the Russians are requesting and that's if the U.S. doesn't impose new sanctions on Iran.....

So it's more likely that Iran will be pushed to a point where they are forced to meet their Air Force needs domestically in the long run and as technology keeps on advancing worldwide and inside Iran this becomes more and more likely!

Sanctions on offansive weapons will be lifted in 2020 not 2023(defansive can be delivered any time since sanctions only ban offansive)...in 2023 all limits on nuclear technology will be lifted ...for weapons it is 2020,it means fighters can't be delivered for 2 years not five and since Iran wants new aircrafts..well even if you order tomorow it would probably take 1-2 years to start delivering...
Russia has offered SU-27SM3 insted SU-30 with delivery in 2020 but iran has rejected this ..and US sanctions would not affect any of this because uniletar sanctions from USA are already in place for weapons and defense technology thus materials that can be used for missiles and nuk.technology.What is import is UN sanctions and those USA can't put o Iran without voice of all 5 permament members of S.C ..including Russia and China.Considering how USA are isolated about Iran nuclear deal withraw ..this will not happen,expecually in today constalations... Russians are try to sell less capable su 27 sm version without electronically scanned array radar and TVC ,Iran ofcourse want version su-30 since it has TVC ,new engines,advanced radars,wider weapons support..and much more...Russia try also to sell s-300VM instedPMU2 but at the end Iran got what wanted.Iran will have much better position in two years after sanctions on weapons are lifted...Now USA sanction would be indeed very bad thing since US sanctions would mean that many countries would also follow USA even legaly no one is in obligation to implemet it ...but I don't think so that contracts with Russia,China and even EU would be canceled since these countries strongly support deal..even UK ,if you look closely even in USA Trum has no support to withraw from deal..but even if they did I think remain countries that signed deal will preserve it, and since USA even now don't want to lift remain sanctions and they do anything they can to block any contract with US companies..well Iran will not loose too much if USA withraw as long EU,UK,China and Russia support it...but to be hoest I don't think even US will withraw from deal.
Sanctions will be lifted five years after deal is signed and good thing is US or anyone can't block this since only thing on what this depend is Iranian part of the deal,that is why Israel and KSA are screaming all over the world.
Now,with these scambags you never now but I think with this deal Iran did good job ,considering what would be alternative...