Indonesia Defence Forum

[Chestnut]

That's only part of the " Grand plans " termed first during the SBY's clans in the army reins . Note the first SAKTI and SAMAR was iniated during that time along the concept of mechanized mobile infantry themes . The idea is try to make a hybrd concept between 101st and 82nd style . Air assault yet still para's qualify on moment notice and full pledged heavy mechanized div were still equipped and trained as a heavy hammer do .
On how they will works on the air mobility concept . i have no idea . not to mention the original creator was allready out of the loop .
But , the KOSTRAD hybrid's Brigade creation was mean some semblance of the core idea are well taken and implemented by the top brass i assumed .

They're better off being reorganized to the Brigade Combat Team structure. Even the Filipinos found that having everything made BCT's with organic air elements makes your troops a lot more deployable and manageable than what we have now.

 

[Nike]

They're better off being reorganized to the Brigade Combat Team structure. Even the Filipinos found that having everything made BCT's with organic air elements makes your troops a lot more deployable and manageable than what we have now.

Talking about BCT, there is talk and effort to get there. The first implementation is to create mechanized infantry Battalion in most of KODAM units, put Cavalry Battalion, Artillery and Air Defense units under the command. Air units still scattered there and here as even Army HQ still lacking adequate number to support Kostrad infantry Division along with other special forces units.

Many years had been spent, but they still lacking in training for new pilots and ground crew units. Infrastructure and logistic is still issue for permanent base outside many big urban region like in Java, Sumatra and Kalimantan.

 

[Ravager]

They're better off being reorganized to the Brigade Combat Team structure. Even the Filipinos found that having everything made BCT's with organic air elements makes your troops a lot more deployable and manageable than what we have now.

Well Nike allready pointed it out for me ...

As i said again most of our recent progressive midle level officer are knowed it and eager for a modernization . But , years of neglect and corruption slowing these changes to almost a crawl .

People can said what they will about mr. Pramono and Agus harimurti . But , in my book they have lay a foundation for the modern ideas during their short time frame managing in Army . Too bad politics got in the way ....

 

[Nike]

Well Nike allready pointed it out for me ...

As i said again most of our recent progressive midle level officer are knowed it and eager for a modernization . But , years of neglect and corruption slowing these changes to almost a crawl .

People can said what they will about mr. Pramono and Agus harimurti . But , in my book they have lay a foundation for the modern ideas during their short time frame managing in Army . Too bad politics got in the way ....

Still there is hope though, many had seen how we will fare when under intense situation when facing peer to peer conflict. The Army realized, the Air Force realized the Navy realized it all the facts we can only do naught when facing against big power and facing tremendous trouble when pitted against middle power one. There is urgent need to add more platform of our weapon system, increase the training workload for every branches (they need joint exercise at least once a year), perfected the doctrine in the field and curicullum module for new recruits and put more emphasize for NCO corps and middle officers corps training and development program.

 

[Nike]

Looking at progress of War in Azerbaijan, we can conclude several important lesson.

Need more to worry about the works of UCAV, they become the real menace on the battlefield at tactical level. Gone the days they only being used to give support at theater level and do Cherry picking jobs far behind enemy lines or support Spec ops units on some Raid or the likes.

Btw heavy MBT or not, it seems APS is a must device nowadays to be attached. And to protect armored column with mobile AA units like Forceshield is a must. AEW and jammer system must be implemented into brigade level units for security purpose.

Then we can conclude the use of loitering munition and UCAV for SEAD mission can reach an approachable level tactically at battlefield. The thing is more convenient and reduce the possible casualties and tremendous number of Fighter aircraft (in which very expensive nowadays).

I thing, even the US Will paying more attention toward this kind of capability as they still finding ways to neutralize maximum AA defense system the likes of China, North Korea and Russia had. Let alone Indonesia who don't have much fighter to begin with.

 

[Ravager]

Looking at progress of War in Azerbaijan, we can conclude several important lesson.

Need more to worry about the works of UCAV, they become the real menace on the battlefield at tactical level. Gone the days they only being used to give support at theater level and do Cherry picking jobs far behind enemy lines or support Spec ops units on some Raid or the likes.

Btw heavy MBT or not, it seems APS is a must device nowadays to be attached. And to protect armored column with mobile AA units like Forceshield is a must. AEW and jammer system must be implemented into brigade level units for security purpose.

Then we can conclude the use of loitering munition and UCAV for SEAD mission can reach an approachable level tactically at battlefield. The thing is more convenient and reduce the possible casualties and tremendous number of Fighter aircraft (in which very expensive nowadays).

I thing, even the US Will paying more attention toward this kind of capability as they still finding ways to neutralize maximum AA defense system the likes of China, North Korea and Russia had. Let alone Indonesia who don't have much fighter to begin with.

To be honest i kind of gratefull that we had such close relationship with the turks and pakistan . With the turks experience on drones ( some say Israelis take the cake but with the scales of such warfare ?? The turks are slowly upping the ante here ) and pakistan higly irregular warfare ( while Iran is another candidate there isn't a viable option there ) ... There are so much thing we could learn from . It's up to us on how much we could utilize that so we benefitted for our own circumstances ...

 

[Nike]

To be honest i kind of gratefull that we had such close relationship with the turks and pakistan . With the turks experience on drones ( some say Israelis take the cake but with the scales of such warfare ?? The turks are slowly upping the ante here ) and pakistan higly irregular warfare ( while Iran is another candidate there isn't a viable option there ) ... There are so much thing we could learn from . It's up to us on how much we could utilize that so we benefitted for our own circumstances ...

Indonesia is quite close to Azeris, even willing to do trade and suffer high imbalance trade to support their economy (we bought their oil directly when there is a lot of viable alternative with cheaper prices at market, with average of minus around 300 to 500 million US Dollar a year). We are symphatetic with their plight of loosing of more than 20 percentage of their own land and hundreds thousand being expulsed from their home.

I don't think highly about current Iran regime. And more important, Turkey is more willing and convenient to do arms business albeit their price quite over the tops, but looking at their performance on the real battlefield i must said they are quite worthy for every centavo being spent at. It must be in line with "ada rupa ada harga". Well with this i am placing more hopes for our medium tank to work well on the battlefield as long as we equipped them with complete package, including APS. These days as i mention before, light or heavy armor, they can be obliterate with Missiles from above, so APS and jammer system is a must.

For Pakistan, they produce a lot of munition like 105, 155 mm class and too RPG

 

[Nike]

Seems Bengpuspalad TNI AD doing upgrade or only maintenance work for AMX 13 fleets? But it seems plaussible as they had doing heavy work to upgrade some vehicles in the past

https://twitter.com/x/status/1314183174939844609

 

[umigami]

If indonesia got F15EX for real, do we have to switch Viper order from block 72 to block 70 instead?
(To get engine commonality)

Because up until now no Super Eagle (EX) certified for pratt and whitney F100 yet.

 

[NEKONEKO]

Looking at progress of War in Azerbaijan, we can conclude several important lesson.

Need more to worry about the works of UCAV, they become the real menace on the battlefield at tactical level. Gone the days they only being used to give support at theater level and do Cherry picking jobs far behind enemy lines or support Spec ops units on some Raid or the likes.

Btw heavy MBT or not, it seems APS is a must device nowadays to be attached. And to protect armored column with mobile AA units like Forceshield is a must. AEW and jammer system must be implemented into brigade level units for security purpose.

Then we can conclude the use of loitering munition and UCAV for SEAD mission can reach an approachable level tactically at battlefield. The thing is more convenient and reduce the possible casualties and tremendous number of Fighter aircraft (in which very expensive nowadays).

I thing, even the US Will paying more attention toward this kind of capability as they still finding ways to neutralize maximum AA defense system the likes of China, North Korea and Russia had. Let alone Indonesia who don't have much fighter to begin with.

I think SPAAG will be good to counter UCAV and loitering munition.

Wouldn't missile with frag warhead (proximity or impact) have better chance to destroy small target such as drones and loitering munition rather than Startstreak missile with its submunitions.

 

[Ravager]

Indonesia is quite close to Azeris, even willing to do trade and suffer high imbalance trade to support their economy (we bought their oil directly when there is a lot of viable alternative with cheaper prices at market, with average of minus around 300 to 500 million US Dollar a year). We are symphatetic with their plight of loosing of more than 20 percentage of their own land and hundreds thousand being expulsed from their home.

I don't think highly about current Iran regime. And more important, Turkey is more willing and convenient to do arms business albeit their price quite over the tops, but looking at their performance on the real battlefield i must said they are quite worthy for every centavo being spent at. It must be in line with "ada rupa ada harga". Well with this i am placing more hopes for our medium tank to work well on the battlefield as long as we equipped them with complete package, including APS. These days as i mention before, light or heavy armor, they can be obliterate with Missiles from above, so APS and jammer system is a must.

For Pakistan, they produce a lot of munition like 105, 155 mm class and too RPG

And all more the reason to proceed .

But , spesifically on MT i kind torn on how to comment on such a limited role AFV . While the merits is there and in our terrain it's a blessed fire support . It's kind of imbalance that are created if we doesn't add any more leo2 to the inventory ...
Drone age aside ... We still need some muscle in the slugfest to come . Say you will about my pettiness but i'm a firm believer of better having it yet not needed then need it yet not having it creed .
But , most of all .... Rather than AFV it self . It's the ATGM availibility and it's subsequent technology that we are sorely lacking

 

[Chestnut]

And all more the reason to proceed .

But , spesifically on MT i kind torn on how to comment on such a limited role AFV . While the merits is there and in our terrain it's a blessed fire support . It's kind of imbalance that are created if we doesn't add any more leo2 to the inventory ...
Drone age aside ... We still need some muscle in the slugfest to come . Say you will about my pettiness but i'm a firm believer of better having it yet not needed then need it yet not having it creed .
But , most of all .... Rather than AFV it self . It's the ATGM availibility and it's subsequent technology that we are sorely lacking

The Key to Armenia’s Tank Losses: The Sensors, Not the Shooters

Amid a lively debate about the viability of the UK’s heavy armour, the loss of over 42 Armenian T-72s to Azerbaijani forces in Nagorno-Karabakh requires further analysis., Despite the heavy Armenian armoured losses, the key lessons from the videos Azerbaijan has published online are not about...

rusi.org

This is a good read for you and @Nike

 

[Ravager]

The Key to Armenia’s Tank Losses: The Sensors, Not the Shooters

Amid a lively debate about the viability of the UK’s heavy armour, the loss of over 42 Armenian T-72s to Azerbaijani forces in Nagorno-Karabakh requires further analysis., Despite the heavy Armenian armoured losses, the key lessons from the videos Azerbaijan has published online are not about...

rusi.org

This is a good read for you and @Nike

As i said before ... Times are changing . And we have to adapt quickly into the new " normal " ..
But , still .. our lack of modern platform are still a concern too . Thanks god ...blessing in disguisses we are all still in the planing procurement process . So we can make more adaptation before making some stupid procurement decission .

Thanks for the link there ...

 

[Nike]

As i said before ... Times are changing . And we have to adapt quickly into the new " normal " ..
But , still .. our lack of modern platform are still a concern too . Thanks god ...blessing in disguisses we are all still in the planing procurement process . So we can make more adaptation before making some stupid procurement decission .

Thanks for the link there ...

Armenian armor losses ranging from 150-200 vehicles, in only seven to ten days of battle, not to mention dozen of artillery system and numerous AA pieces in class of OSA, TOR even S300. Can we absorb such losses if we are fighting against peer opponent equipped with such standard technology?

I thing such losses is quite normal in such battle between peer opponent. It just who had more industry, money and man power to backing it up. Indonesia had all of three but not the political Will

 

[Ravager]

Armenian armor losses ranging from 150-200 vehicles, in only seven to ten days of battle, not to mention dozen of artillery system and numerous AA pieces in class of OSA, TOR even S300. Can we absorb such losses if we are fighting against peer opponent equipped with such standard technology?

I thing such losses is quite normal in such battle between peer opponent. It just who had more industry, money and man power to backing it up. Indonesia had all of three but not the political Will

Call me a heartless but i believe we still can bear double or triple such a losses . It's troops morales that i'll be more concerned off ... it take time and hardship to create a hardened soldier .
At the end of day ... Prevention is the key here . Know your enemy and know yourself else , We all be slaughtered cheaply as a canon fodder .