Indonesia Defence Forum

[Chestnut]

I'll tell you guys something that you may or may not already know. The reason Komodo Armaments isn't doing so well commercially isn't because of bad product design, sub-par manufacturing, or lack of marketing (as their products in my opinion are of superior quality than those that are made by Pindad). But rather government meddling through KKIP that intentionally puts them down out of concern of rivaling Pindad.

 

[Nike]

I'll tell you guys something that you may or may not already know. The reason Komodo Armaments isn't doing so well commercially isn't because of bad product design, sub-par manufacturing, or lack of marketing (as their products in my opinion are of superior quality than those that are made by Pindad). But rather government meddling through KKIP that intentionally puts them down out of concern of rivaling Pindad.

One who survived out of competition can't have sub-par products, PINDAD is silver spon fed child, they don't know the challenge out there. Tanfoglio got long history and survived out there with civillian market and supplying products toward defense entities around the world including Israel defense forces.

US and western Europe civillian arms market is very demanding and the competition is very harsh, lot of big companies fight it out and always give the best design just to survive.

 

[Lasa-X]

IMO, Army is ok to have their own MERAD in needed.
In the past, kohanudnas was operated by AF and army personnels.
Now, kohanudnas coordinates all air defence units from 3 services.

I agree there are rivalry between services. It's common thing around the world. But it is not like army want to have Vipers or Su-35. Or AF want to have leopard or armata.

Like it or not army has the biggest land based air defence units in this country and needed to be upgraded. I don't think AF alone is sufficient to protect obvit and cover their assets let alone to protect other services.

Even now Navy has their own short -medium range SAM, VL Mica for fleet protection and I don't mind if they look for land based VL Mica for yonmarhanlan to replace their antique AAA guns (and stop using monuments) in the future.

 

[GraveDigger388]

IMO, Army is ok to have their own MERAD in needed.
In the past, kohanudnas was operated by AF and army personnels.
Now, kohanudnas coordinates all air defence units from 3 services.

I agree there are rivalry between services. It's common thing around the world. But it is not like army want to have Vipers or Su-35. Or AF want to have leopard or armata.

Like it or not army has the biggest land based air defence units in this country and needed to be upgraded. I don't think AF alone is sufficient to protect obvit and cover their assets let alone to protect other services.

Even now Navy has their own short -medium range SAM, VL Mica for fleet protection and I don't mind if they look for land based VL Mica for yonmarhanlan to replace their antique AAA guns (and stop using monuments) in the future.

This.

Aerial defenses should be utilized by all branches. That said, Air Force should be given the edge, such as, say...theater-level air defense, and ballistic missile...


Ideally...

 

[Nike]

IMO, Army is ok to have their own MERAD in needed.
In the past, kohanudnas was operated by AF and army personnels.
Now, kohanudnas coordinates all air defence units from 3 services.

I agree there are rivalry between services. It's common thing around the world. But it is not like army want to have Vipers or Su-35. Or AF want to have leopard or armata.

Like it or not army has the biggest land based air defence units in this country and needed to be upgraded. I don't think AF alone is sufficient to protect obvit and cover their assets let alone to protect other services.

Even now Navy has their own short -medium range SAM, VL Mica for fleet protection and I don't mind if they look for land based VL Mica for yonmarhanlan to replace their antique AAA guns (and stop using monuments) in the future.

to have more ships based SAM system is more valuable for our Navy. They are more mobile, more able to cope with many different scenarios . For Marines they should be armed with land based ASHM launcher and mobile SPAAG, this will be enough to create anti sea denial umbrella and prevent enemy to launch Amphibious assault

 

[NEKONEKO]

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=1457442207753996

Land based + KCR + Stealth Trimaran(!?)

 

[Chestnut]

I genuinely don't care who operates it, as long as the missiles used are interchangeable and inter-operable among the 3 branches. For example if the Air Force uses the NSM/JSM then I expect the Navy to operate the naval launched variant and the army to operate the shore battery variant. If the Navy operates the SM-2/ESSM then I expect the army to operate the Patriot/MEADS and the Air Force to operate the datalinked GCI radars for long range tracking. And if the Army operates the SAMP/T then I expect the Navy to operate the Aster 15/30 and the Air Force datalinks their AWACS with the other branches.

The boomers can have their pissing contests all they want but as long as what they buy can inter-operate with whats already operated by all the other branches it's no skin off my nose.

 

[Fl0gger]

Its great that you guys agree that competition and foreign bidding is good for business. I see a lot of people on formils constantly parroting that inviting foreign defense companies is a bad idea because of 'antek asing'


When I met somebody from PUSENKAV awhile ago, they seem to really not want to use the Kaplan. Among the things that they dislike about it is the size (the average indonesian soldier can't see out of the slits due to the vehicle being designed around the average Turkish male), operational costs, and that they'd rather have a competition in which they would get their input on what kind of vehicle should replace the AMX and the Scorpion. The Kaplan MT is pretty much forced onto the Cavalry forces due to political meddling.

Whether or not they want MBT's is a mixed response (though it could have changed by now), around the time I was working with them, half the people wanted more (composed of mostly the younger officers) and the other half wanted smaller FSV's akin to the AMX (composed of the boomers and those who served in Aceh).

oh realy they dony want use kaplan becouse kaplan size is design for avarage turkis male and want MBT instead well now leo's is or is not design for avarage german male...? so what the differnt ..?? lets me remind u kaplan desing is also involved pindan expert so i suppose they a ware abaout that problem right..so it realy funny yet it so rediculas reason for pusenkav not using kaplan just becouse of it and yes those you call bomer and serve i aceh at least they for fuc*ing real contribute for NKRI and given their lives to i served on aceh and i lost a good freind of mine a father for yet born child show ur respect and i asking you now what contribution you make to this nation except dig in fortune by saling product for TNI for your own concern..?? whos the real boomer now..??

i hate boomer like most of you but although i hate them i still give them a respect at least for their contribution in field after all they are the real operator nor like most of us here just as military enthusiast regard

 

[Chestnut]

oh realy they dony want use kaplan becouse kaplan size is design for avarage turkis male and want MBT instead well now leo's is or is not design for avarage german male...? so what the differnt ..?? lets me remind u kaplan desing is also involved pindan expert so i suppose they a ware abaout that problem right..so it realy funny yet it so rediculas reason for pusenkav not using kaplan just becouse of it and yes those you call bomer and serve i aceh at least they for fuc*ing real contribute for NKRI and given their lives to i served on aceh and i lost a good freind of mine a father for yet born child show ur respect and i asking you now what contribution you make to this nation except dig in fortune by saling product for TNI for your own concern..?? whos the real boomer now..??

i hate boomer like most of you but although i hate them i still give them a respect at least for their contribution in field after all they are the real operator nor like most of us here just as military enthusiast regard

Ok boomer.

 

[Fl0gger]

Ok boomer.

ok slope

 

[striver44]

Please give SAAB a chance . Lol

 

[san.geuk]

Hey come on, why chestnut get banned? If you don't like his view at least you give proper denial, this is not kaskus
Don't make your personal opion for being represif on this forum, this kind of mentality make formil kaskus like shit today, like banning solid contributor and get offended by unsubstansce debate

I tell you something cause you seems offended by word "boomer", do you know what boomer is? Search keyword "boomer generation" its nothing to do with insulting,
Kembangkan wawasan anda bung!

 

[initial_d]

come on guys, grown up will you, we get it if some of the word may be offending for some member here, but don't escalated it into insult war, this is a good forum, we don't want to be like formil right, where small percentage of member thinking they are better or more knowledgeable than other, get over it will ya

 

[Kansel]

Great, ******* great you get offended then you banned him. Really great

 

[Cromwell]

Chestnut is a great contributor in this forum, his insights way more interesting than most forumers here and he can frequently be here to post his views way more than i do ( i reveal myself here, i am among emergency unit physician/medical doctors in COVID 19 reference hospital in West Java, 2nd worst hit province in Indonesia so i can't post anything here as frequent as i used to be and certainly not as frequent as Chestnut does ). I don't appreciate this act of banning him and demand him to be relieved of ban immidiately.