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India seeks full membership of SCO

no it doesnt lol. its true Pakistan doesnt have much leverage over Iran but neither does India.

On a comparitive basis....India does have more leverage than Pakistan...

Iran will sell its oil to anyone who wants to buy it including SCO.

If you've been following my responses to the poster who I wrote this to....

You will notice that he has claimed that Pakistan being a member of OIC is going to help leverage the sale of oil to SCO....

So if your above statement is true, then its also true that the ME will sell to anyone who wants to buy including the SCO.....So what is Pakistan bringing to the table?

As far as security for the oil reaching its intended destination is concerned, India has a much larger role to play than Pakistan...

My responses were aimed using this line of thought...
 
Not necessarily. Considering the fact that energy and security are amongst some of the things emcompassed by the bloc. Pakistan in fact have more roles to play in that area as they are in brotherly terms with the 'Organisation of the Islamic Conference' which India isn't a part of. Countries within OIC are important for the future energy needs and development for China and Russia, therefore Pakistan plays a crucial role here.
Pakistan,
with the help of both China and Russia can help transform and make full use the Gwadar Port which would generate billions in revenue and bring about further jobs investments into Pakistan.
Pakistan is also facing energy shortage, therefore Kyrgyzstan will surely welcome having Pakistan onboard and look to the possibility of stabilizing Afghanistan to make the CASA-1000 project possible. If India wants to make the TAPI project possible, then they will have to work ever more closely with Pakistan and drop the 'one or the other' mentality. Unless they want to lose out on it and have China turn it into a TAPC project.

Therefore I would have to disagree with your initial thought that India brings more to the table than Pakistan does. Fact of the matter is, both India and Pakistan have different characteristics and roles to play :azn:

The below throws some light on the influence of Pakistan in the Muslim world, in particular the Arabs who are the main source of the oil...

http://www.defence.pk/forums/world-affairs/108957-arab-league-says-cannot-league-separatists-kashmir.html
 
We are talking about gas here....NOT oil...

India has no problem in securing oil from the ME....

India already has civilian nuclear deals as an alternate to the gas pipelines.....as mentioned,The IPI was minimal loss to us when we can get energy through nuclear power that is more efficient and cleaner..
Doesnt mean that the TAPI wont help our cause, but its not something worth breaking our heads over either....

Nuclear power is not an alternative for India's energy needs. It will need those pipelines. Nuclear power is not very efficient and produces too much radioactive waste.
 
Unfortunately, China may have the veto...but so does every country including Russia....

Russia may have provided its backing to Pakistan for membership of the SCO, but I would be surprised if they did so without the conditional entry of India in the bloc...
I wouldnt give China more importance than the other nations in the bloc..



Could be because Pakistan has realized that its impending economic problems will not be mitigated by the west backing it up anymore, especially given their poor stretch of relations with US and the leverage they hold in IMF....Pakistan has also failed to secure a deal with the EU to help recover its economy.

My hunch is that this is China's way of preventing alienation of Pak....just as the US grandfathered the clearance of the Indo-US deal, China may have lobbied for this with Russia based on conditional entry of India...Contrary to the view of people (Chinese and Pakistanis) on this forum, Russians are not doing this out of love for Pakistan...
SCO guarantees energy security for Pak through the energy rich CARs and economic co-operation and trade through the CARs again....
Do remember that Russian influence is essential for Pak to be able to maintain unhindered trade relations with CARs countries...



You cant just throw out random statements without proof....either its your assumption or that you know of Russian "interests" in Pak that we dont know of...either way, it would be great if you could share some of those with us...

Also...I am extremely confident of the Indo-Russian relationship and can guarantee that India on any day is a more important strategic and economic partner than Pakistan can ever be (given that we have 60 years over them)....
If Pakistan has the potential to overturn Indo Russian relationship in their favor, then hats off to them.....I personally dont see it and in my opinion the overestimation of potential comes from you wrt. Pakistan

1, no one knows the attitude of Russia, but the bottom line is that if India did not want to take responsibility, you will not be eligible to join the SCO, all Member States are in this position. Also, you need to know any of the SCO Member States have a veto, if a member of Pakistan, then India will be more difficult to join, even if you do not need to care about China to agree or disagree. This is one of the reasons India hasty action.

2, no matter how you think, China is the core of the same importance as Russia, Russia can not fight alone with NATO, or the price is high, China too, but if China and Russia cooperate will be able to provide adequate protection. And China can provide more than the Russian in economy and trade, no one can provide so many things in the SCO.

3, Yes, as you said, it is possible, there is a condition on India to join, in theory, a possibility. But not like, my personal view. Look, it seems that Russia has agreed to join Pakistan, except for some conditions for their own interests and no other conditions, such as India to join. of course, right or wrong, only time will tell.

4, this is BBS discussion, no one can get classified documents from the national leaders, all is subjective opinion, me too. We have discussed many times, at least in theory, Pakistan can provide important benefits to Russia. Mainly , regional security, to ensure that Russia's backyard influence, trade and energy channels, the integration of economic cooperation in Central Asia. All is enough and important.

5, of course, as long as India do not mind Russia close to Pakistan, I think Russia will be very happy to maintain relations and India. Of course, the better, long live the friendship between Russia and India. I congratulate you, as long as India does not mind some minor problems .
 
Location ?? Are you out of your mind ??


Their is a difference between location of Russia and China. They have direct connectivity to Europe
And for middle east I think you should check world map before posting childish comments :lol:

It's to do with taxes and duties, shorter transit times, warm waters with year round trade, African continent trade. Look it up.

Probably most important is access to year round trading for the Russians. Arms supplies would be insignificant in the long run.
 
Nuclear power is not an alternative for India's energy needs. It will need those pipelines. Nuclear power is not very efficient and produces too much radioactive waste.

What brings you to the conclusion that nuclear energy will not suffice the Indian need? Please quote some stats....

From an efficiency standpoint, nuclear power is way more efficient that gas anyday being that small quantities produce exhorbitant amount of energy....
Radioactive waste is a secondary concern....

We do not need gas pipelines....I would like you to prove this otherwise.
 
The below throws some light on the influence of Pakistan in the Muslim world, in particular the Arabs who are the main source of the oil...

http://www.defence.pk/forums/world-affairs/108957-arab-league-says-cannot-league-separatists-kashmir.html

I fail to see the point you are trying to make by posting up that link? Perhaps you can elaborate on it and field a constructive argument for the benefit of the readers here on this forum?

Before you do so, let me kindly remind you that SCO are concerned with regional security issues and encompasses issues to do with regional economy, energy and developments. India does not belong to the Central Asian region nor have enough influence in the area that bridges Asia and the Middle-East. So in terms of bringing stability to the regions concerned and providing ease and cheaper access to energy routes, Pakistan and Afghanistan holds more value to every permanent members of the SCO alliance.

Inarguably, India can be a valuable member of the SCO if they are successfully admitted, providing that they are willing to fully co-operate. It's role and contributions, however, would be very different to Pakistan and Afghanistan's due to its location and relations with other Islamic states and factions.
 
Has Pakistan been banned from the OIC (Organization of Islamic Conference), or the Arab League?

No, but India has.

What does that say about the "influence of India in the Muslim world"?

IOC ?? :rofl:
Do we need OIC ?? :no:
 
Has Pakistan been banned from the OIC (Organization of Islamic Conference), or the Arab League?

No, but India has.

What does that say about the "influence of India in the Muslim world"?

lol i searched for this so called OIC and turns out pakistan has blocked us due to so called kashmir issue..
who cares about such stupid orgs that are just for namesake...
I dont think SCO is any different than this SCO..
 
, this is BBS discussion, no one can get classified documents from the national leaders, all is subjective opinion, me too. We have discussed many times, at least in theory, Pakistan can provide important benefits to Russia. Mainly , regional security, to ensure that Russia's backyard influence, trade and energy channels, the integration of economic cooperation in Central Asia. All is enough and important.

5, of course, as long as India do not mind Russia close to Pakistan, I think Russia will be very happy to maintain relations and India. Of course, the better, long live the friendship between Russia and India. I congratulate you, as long as India does not mind some minor problems .

At least some one talking sense.

Anyways SCO is not here to challenge Nato in any shape and form ; Its here to safeguard it Interest in its Immediate vicinity.

Russia is not close to Pakistan(not that i mind) it has been lobbied by China to Endorse its arrival into there own corporation ..simple Fact.
By this move China is stating that it hold Russia as an First tier partner and without Russia's connect, it wont move forward.

Russia has asked India Involvement into the SCO, so as to not get diplomatically Isolated within the organization without no one backing there strategies.

India will always mind anything to do with Pakistan -Fact,
Better diplomatic reciprocity is gonna dissolve the sentiment & Anyone else saying we need to(China), will not.

Counties aren't fools so as to forget the past and give in to some love-dovy charm offensives and are rarely susceptible to be lead by the nose.(unlike a few)
The SCO needs at least 10 to 20 years of Internal diplomatic and Inter-economical strength building measure to be validated as a close nit organization.

The fact the some people lead by comparing it some o-so-secret tree club that is only going to keep there closest friends , do nothing but flaunt there immaturity .
 
At least some one talking sense.

Anyways SCO is not here to challenge Nato in any shape and form ; Its here to safeguard it Interest in its Immediate vicinity.

Russia is not close to Pakistan(not that i mind) it has been lobbied by China to Endorse its arrival into there own corporation ..simple Fact.
By this move China is stating that it hold Russia as an First tier partner and without Russia's connect, it wont move forward.

Russia has asked India Involvement into the SCO, so as to not get diplomatically Isolated within the organization without no one backing there strategies.

India will always mind anything to do with Pakistan -Fact,
Better diplomatic reciprocity is gonna dissolve the sentiment & Anyone else saying we need to(China), will not.

Counties aren't fools so as to forget the past and give in to some love-dovy charm offensives and are rarely susceptible to be lead by the nose.(unlike a few)
The SCO needs at least 10 to 20 years of Internal diplomatic and Inter-economical strength building measure to be validated as a close nit organization.

The fact the some people lead by comparing it some o-so-secret tree club that is only going to keep there closest friends , do nothing but flaunt there immaturity .

Yes, some common sense.

I have already said, it is a small chance to become a full NATO-style military alliance. But a closer regional economic, political and military alliance is in this way.

Any of the SCO member states have veto power, so no matter how Russia would like, as long as China to veto, you can not join. More clearly the fact that Russia also know that, but he still agreed to join Pakistan, not as in the past ten years, This broke the deadlock ten years, which means what?, of course, like I said, to praise the friendship of India and Russia, it is good, as long as India is also satisfied, everyone is happy.

To more clearly the meaning of organization on regional cooperation and integration, and why it is regional, but open to everyone.
 
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