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India lost in Afghan endgame.

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India lost in Afghan endgame

By Kanwal Sibal

Issue Courtesy: Mail Today | Date : 27 Aug , 2013

The situation in Afghanistan is full of uncertainties and the prospects of India’s neighbourhood becoming even more difficult for us are real. We have little control over the situation in Afghanistan, however popular we may be with its government and people. We have invested considerable political and financial capital in Afghanistan for protecting our longer term interests in the region, but adequate returns are not guaranteed.

Afghanistan has been a conflict zone for over three decades now. To our misfortune it became a cold war battleground between the Soviet Union and the US, with the result that both an extremist version of Islam and Pakistan became powerful actors in shaping developments there under the US lead. Until then, Pakistan was not a dominant factor in Afghanistan internally and externally. Later, as US attention moved towards Iraq, Pakistan saw an opportunity to control Afghanistan strategically by using Islamic fanaticism embodied by the Taliban as a tool.

Hare & Hounds

The deliberate Islamisation of Pakistan by Zia-ul-Haq prepared a favourable ground for the creation of the Taliban under Benazir Bhutto’s civilian government. The nurturing of extremist religious groups by the Pakistan military for terrorist attacks against India was another facet of the growing Islamization of Pakistan’s society and the practical use of these forces for political ends, as in Afghanistan’s case.

Religious fanatics in our region gained further force with Al Qaida’s entry on the back of the Taliban. These forces overplayed their hand in attacking the US on September 11, inviting an American military riposte that ousted the Taliban from power. That Osama Laden got refuge in Pakistan for many years in different places points to the existence of an effective network of Islamist cells in Pakistan, which raises concerns for the future. When, with Taliban’s ouster, US attention turned towards Iraq for the second time, Pakistan once again saw an opportunity to regain its lost ground in Afghanistan through the Taliban groups it continued sheltering on its territory.

With Taliban groups targeting NATO forces from safe-havens in Pakistan, US pressure on Pakistan to control these groups was inevitable. This exposed the inherent contradiction in Pakistan’s posture on religious extremism and terrorism, with the Pakistan state and society, at one level, nurturing these forces, while, at another level, acting against them under external constraint. This policy of running with the hare and hunting with the hound has exposed Pakistan to accusations of duplicity and double-faced policies by its western supporters, a discovery India made years earlier. But this awakening has not brought about any drastic change in the West’s handling either of Pakistan per se or its destabilizing ambitions in Afghanistan.

The Third Time

The irony from India’s point of view is that having fortified the virus of Islamism in the region and then having combated it at great human, financial and military cost, the US and the West are once again reaching out to the same forces, this time not to defeat a cold war rival but to cover up their own retreat with a veneer of semi-success. The accommodation of the Taliban in the mid-1990s was for immediate economic allurements, with no concern that such obscurantist forces would spread terror to the US. The US overlooked the problematic aspects of Pakistan’s conduct because of tepid India-US relations. Pakistan was a useful balancing factor.

Today India and the US have a strategic partnership. The US has a grand vision of linking Central Asia and South Asia through a new silk road, with energy projects like TAPI as a centre-piece. It seems to want to repeat its previous mis-reading of Taliban’s Islamic fanaticism by believing that its commitment to break links with Al Qaida would protect the US from future terrorist attacks. This will be the third time that the US will take Afghanistan off its radar screen, benefiting once again the Taliban with its religious ideology and Pakistan with its strategic ambitions while compromising India’s interests despite the so-called transformation of India-US ties.

In a hard place

India will be hard put to secure its interests in Afghanistan in the conditions under which the US intends to withdraw. The Afghan security forces may be able to prevent an outright Taliban military victory, but providing security all over the country against Taliban depredations would be outside their capacity, given their present ability to stage terrorist attacks even in highly protected areas such as Kabul. Sending more security personnel to protect our projects is not a solution.

Though we have a strategic partnership agreement with Afghanistan that provides also for arms support, even if we were to step up our training assistance considerably and provide some combat equipment, it would not substitute for the Afghan army’s lack of air support, heavy weaponry and intelligence capability. Pakistan is determined to neutralize India’s influence in Afghanistan, as the attack on our Jalalabad consulate indicates unfortunately. It is allergic to the idea of an India-friendly Afghan government. It finds it intolerable that we train Afghan military officers in India when their offers to provide such training are being rebuffed. Nawaz Sharif has begun voicing the charge that India is behind some disturbances in Pakistan.

We can help reduce the threats to Afghanistan’s internal stability in consultation with Iran, Russia and the Central Asian states. China cannot be relied upon because in any scenario it will be with Pakistan and leverage its influence with the Taliban to protect Chinese interests. Pakistan is central to China’s strategy to economically exploit Afghanistan and link it and neighbouring Central Asian states to its upgraded Karakoram highway connected to Gwadar. All in all, our stakes in Afghanistan are high but our means to protect them insufficient and uncertain.

India lost in Afghan endgame » Indian Defence Review
 
So congratulation to Pakistan. Now do not complaint about india's role in Afghanistan since India has already lost.If you complaints, It will prove that India has not lost but India is in a dictating Position in Afghanistan.
 
@HariPrasad 2 Billion dollars - tut tut tut tut.... :no:

tumblr_lwlmy5SnzT1qh2jvho1_500.gif
 
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India lost in Afghan endgame

By Kanwal Sibal

Issue Courtesy: Mail Today | Date : 27 Aug , 2013

The situation in Afghanistan is full of uncertainties and the prospects of India’s neighbourhood becoming even more difficult for us are real. We have little control over the situation in Afghanistan, however popular we may be with its government and people. We have invested considerable political and financial capital in Afghanistan for protecting our longer term interests in the region, but adequate returns are not guaranteed.

Afghanistan has been a conflict zone for over three decades now. To our misfortune it became a cold war battleground between the Soviet Union and the US, with the result that both an extremist version of Islam and Pakistan became powerful actors in shaping developments there under the US lead. Until then, Pakistan was not a dominant factor in Afghanistan internally and externally. Later, as US attention moved towards Iraq, Pakistan saw an opportunity to control Afghanistan strategically by using Islamic fanaticism embodied by the Taliban as a tool.

Hare & Hounds

The deliberate Islamisation of Pakistan by Zia-ul-Haq prepared a favourable ground for the creation of the Taliban under Benazir Bhutto’s civilian government. The nurturing of extremist religious groups by the Pakistan military for terrorist attacks against India was another facet of the growing Islamization of Pakistan’s society and the practical use of these forces for political ends, as in Afghanistan’s case.

Religious fanatics in our region gained further force with Al Qaida’s entry on the back of the Taliban. These forces overplayed their hand in attacking the US on September 11, inviting an American military riposte that ousted the Taliban from power. That Osama Laden got refuge in Pakistan for many years in different places points to the existence of an effective network of Islamist cells in Pakistan, which raises concerns for the future. When, with Taliban’s ouster, US attention turned towards Iraq for the second time, Pakistan once again saw an opportunity to regain its lost ground in Afghanistan through the Taliban groups it continued sheltering on its territory.

With Taliban groups targeting NATO forces from safe-havens in Pakistan, US pressure on Pakistan to control these groups was inevitable. This exposed the inherent contradiction in Pakistan’s posture on religious extremism and terrorism, with the Pakistan state and society, at one level, nurturing these forces, while, at another level, acting against them under external constraint. This policy of running with the hare and hunting with the hound has exposed Pakistan to accusations of duplicity and double-faced policies by its western supporters, a discovery India made years earlier. But this awakening has not brought about any drastic change in the West’s handling either of Pakistan per se or its destabilizing ambitions in Afghanistan.

The Third Time

The irony from India’s point of view is that having fortified the virus of Islamism in the region and then having combated it at great human, financial and military cost, the US and the West are once again reaching out to the same forces, this time not to defeat a cold war rival but to cover up their own retreat with a veneer of semi-success. The accommodation of the Taliban in the mid-1990s was for immediate economic allurements, with no concern that such obscurantist forces would spread terror to the US. The US overlooked the problematic aspects of Pakistan’s conduct because of tepid India-US relations. Pakistan was a useful balancing factor.

Today India and the US have a strategic partnership. The US has a grand vision of linking Central Asia and South Asia through a new silk road, with energy projects like TAPI as a centre-piece. It seems to want to repeat its previous mis-reading of Taliban’s Islamic fanaticism by believing that its commitment to break links with Al Qaida would protect the US from future terrorist attacks. This will be the third time that the US will take Afghanistan off its radar screen, benefiting once again the Taliban with its religious ideology and Pakistan with its strategic ambitions while compromising India’s interests despite the so-called transformation of India-US ties.

In a hard place

India will be hard put to secure its interests in Afghanistan in the conditions under which the US intends to withdraw. The Afghan security forces may be able to prevent an outright Taliban military victory, but providing security all over the country against Taliban depredations would be outside their capacity, given their present ability to stage terrorist attacks even in highly protected areas such as Kabul. Sending more security personnel to protect our projects is not a solution.

Though we have a strategic partnership agreement with Afghanistan that provides also for arms support, even if we were to step up our training assistance considerably and provide some combat equipment, it would not substitute for the Afghan army’s lack of air support, heavy weaponry and intelligence capability. Pakistan is determined to neutralize India’s influence in Afghanistan, as the attack on our Jalalabad consulate indicates unfortunately. It is allergic to the idea of an India-friendly Afghan government. It finds it intolerable that we train Afghan military officers in India when their offers to provide such training are being rebuffed. Nawaz Sharif has begun voicing the charge that India is behind some disturbances in Pakistan.

We can help reduce the threats to Afghanistan’s internal stability in consultation with Iran, Russia and the Central Asian states. China cannot be relied upon because in any scenario it will be with Pakistan and leverage its influence with the Taliban to protect Chinese interests. Pakistan is central to China’s strategy to economically exploit Afghanistan and link it and neighbouring Central Asian states to its upgraded Karakoram highway connected to Gwadar. All in all, our stakes in Afghanistan are high but our means to protect them insufficient and uncertain.

India lost in Afghan endgame » Indian Defence Review

Indians forgot why HinduKush mountain range is called Hindu Kush if USA is defeated along with other strongest powers what the hell Indians were thinking that Afghans specially the Taliban would have tolerated them never Sir they shouldn't have entered Afghanistan even in small numbers but now their are great chances that after USA and Nato with drawl the focus of Afghan Fighters may shift to Kashmir and India
 
@Aeronaut unlike yesterday , today i have read this with an open mind and have nothing to saying on India's usual ranting and accusations - so am not gona talk about that.

The interesting thing to read here is that at least someone in India has accepted and acknowledged the fact that whatever followed after Soviet invasion was done under the lead of US, including Kabul take over by Taliban, that is the highlight of the article for me.

Another thing is, India is finally recognising that merely investing money and providing small arms will not help to sustain security in the country, it will not help them even in shorter terms. They have realized for now that providing equipment & training to security forces will not help them secure any place in Afghanistan. They will need other players on board, and I am expecting something more to come in next review, something more along the lines of cutting peace deals with Taliban and bringing other stakeholders in the Region including China & Pakistan on board.

overall a nice review, I shall be reading IDR regularly from now on
 
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@Aeronaut unlike yesterday , today i have read this with an open mind and have nothing to saying on India's usual ranting and accusations - so am not gona talk about that.

The interesting thing to read here is that at least someone in India has accepted and acknowledged the fact that whatever followed after Soviet invasion was done under the lead of US, including Kabul take over by Taliban, that is the highlight of the article for me.

Another thing is, India is finally recognising that merely investing money and providing small arms will not help to sustain security in the country, it will not help them even in shorter terms. They have realized for now that providing equipment & training to security forces will not help them secure any place in Afghanistan. They will need other players on board, and I am expecting something more to come in next review, something more along the lines of cutting peace deals with Taliban and bringing other stakeholders in the Region including China & Pakistan on board.

overall a nice review, I shall be reading IDR regularly from now on


The future belongs to the SinoPak camp in South Asia. India thanks to its 'poke nose' policy over the last 66 years has starved itself from any real friends to rely upon. Sri Lanka is down, Nepal is down, Bangladesh and Afghanistan are left to be brought to our camp. Iran and Arabs will join whichever side wins. :coffee:
 
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India lost in Afghan endgame

By Kanwal Sibal

We can help reduce the threats to Afghanistan’s internal stability in consultation with Iran, Russia and the Central Asian states. China cannot be relied upon because in any scenario it will be with Pakistan and leverage its influence with the Taliban to protect Chinese interests. Pakistan is central to China’s strategy to economically exploit Afghanistan and link it and neighbouring Central Asian states to its upgraded Karakoram highway connected to Gwadar. All in all, our stakes in Afghanistan are high but our means to protect them insufficient and uncertain.

India lost in Afghan endgame » Indian Defence Review

:) 1. I removed the childish parts from the above. IDR write ups are always another reflection of BRForum. using street language like "Islamic virus".

Anyway the remaining part above in the opening post I want to comment

A. the writer used word "We" its laughable because the only problem and shortcoming of India is the lack of this trait "we" viz a viz Afghanistan since India was never we and wont be. It has been proven by his continuation of the sentence bringing in the real "We" that is Iran. Russia, China :))))).

So you can assess further these "we" are the main and India is just a peeking tom who wants the sugar pie .

If India wants the pie it must decide which block it wants to jump for a free ride. You got Nuke Deal with US which has served you no purpose SO far don't know what is in store for future but it seems doubtful as well because India has itself invited US to meddle and now stuck in its own invitation; As US-India want control over Indian Ocean totally without anyone letting in, Russia wont be much happy either. In Afghanistan if India US wont be much happy for all Russian influence. So which exactly which block India can join???

Decide it first and it will be easy for you to create your stakes in that region otherwise you don't have so there is no question of protecting them in first place.
 
The future belongs to the SinoPak camp in South Asia. India thanks to its 'poke nose' policy over the last 66 years has starved itself from any real friends to rely upon. Sri Lanka is down, Nepal is down, Bangladesh and Afghanistan are left to be brought to our camp. Iran and Arabs will join whichever side wins. :coffee:

Well tbh when I look back today i don't see things I should be proud of, we have done things for so called strategic depth and had to pay with blood for it.

Talking about Indian Allies than doing such agreements and strategic dialogues it has got itself into more confusion, and now it will be hard for India to pick side especially when t comes to Iran & afghanistan.
 
Well tbh when I look back today i don't see things I should be proud of, we have done things for so called strategic depth and had to pay with blood for it.

Talking about Indian Allies than doing such agreements and strategic dialogues it has got itself into more confusion, and now it will be hard for India to pick side especially when t comes to Iran & afghanistan.


All we have to do at this stage is to 'Wait & don't disturb India'. Afghans don't give loyalty, Hindus don't believe in friendship, Afghans don't listen, India plans to buy them out, Afghans think of Indian investment as 'help', Indians 'worship money' [Lakshmi] and believe in profiteering. -. There are inherient fault lines between the duo and, it will be an interesting show to watch. All we need to do at this stage is to 'let them mingle', the chicken will come back to roost in 5 years, and then we can 'kill that chicken to scare the monkey.'
 
Rightly said I have said this earlier as well and discussed with Indian friends from UK, india is using the same strategy as US in 2001 , when CIA bought Afghan warlords in return for their loyalty, but that was war, and even that didn't turn out pretty well, as same warlords back stabbed US and blackmail US.

if India thinks that paying / investing in Afghanistan & inviting students to come & study will get them a free pass than it will be a grave mistake on India's side, as they will be ignoring past history & nature of Afghans, those you can kill a brother just for a piece of land can go to any extreme limit for anything.

As you said Pakistan needs to sit this one down, if we cant cut loose our strategic depth, atleast we can put them to hibernation

All we have to do at this stage is to 'Wait & don't disturb India'. Afghans don't give loyalty, Hindus don't believe in friendship, Afghans don't listen, India plans to buy them out, Afghans think of Indian investment as 'help', Indians 'worship money' [Lakshmi] and believe in profiteering. -. There are inherient fault lines between the duo and, it will be an interesting show to watch. All we need to do at this stage is to 'let them mingle', the chicken will come back to roost in 5 years, and then we can 'kill that chicken to scare the monkey.'
 
All this over someone's opinion ? aren't you guys biting the bullet too early ? nothing is really sure until 2014 withdrawal next year and how long it will take for them to win/lose the fight against Taliban ....
 
Rightly said I have said this earlier as well and discussed with Indian friends from UK, india is using the same strategy as US in 2001 , when CIA bought Afghan warlords in return for their loyalty, but that was war, and even that didn't turn out pretty well, as same warlords back stabbed US and blackmail US.

if India thinks that paying / investing in Afghanistan & inviting students to come & study will get them a free pass than it will be a grave mistake on India's side, as they will be ignoring past history & nature of Afghans, those you can kill a brother just for a piece of land can go to any extreme limit for anything.

As you said Pakistan needs to sit this one down, if we cant cut loose our strategic depth, atleast we can put them to hibernation

Put the SDS on ice for sometime.

Indians have absolutely no idea, how corrupt Afghan warlords are. Its in our interest if India learns the hard way.

All this over someone's opinion ? aren't you guys biting the bullet too early ? nothing is really sure until 2014 withdrawal next year and how long it will take for them to win/lose the fight against Taliban ....

Purpose of the forum is to 'discuss the recent events' - we can't just shut up and wait for the magic number of 2014 can we?
 
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Purpose of the forum is to 'discuss the recent events' - we can't just shut up and wait for the magic number of 2014 can we?

The heading of the thread and your comments only show that you already decided who won or lost......even if NATO withdraws...

Defending interests in Afghanistan: India can play key role in bringing together an anti-Taliban alliance - Economic Times

By Jaideep A Prabhu

Last weekend's bombing in Jalalabad came as a reminder to India's policymakers that there is no free lunch in international relations. Together with the news of the escape of hundreds of jihadists from Libya, Iraq and Pakistan as well as the United States reconsidering the resumption of its military aid to Pakistan, India needs to think fast on how to defend its interests in Afghanistan.

India's present options are not pretty. Even if India were to increase military and infrastructural assistance to Afghanistan, even if it were to create and deploy an elite "Diplomatic Assets Protection Force" to its four missions in Afghanistan, Delhi cannot hope that it would be enough. Given the humbling even the greatest empires have received in the mountainous central Asian state, what can India do that countless others before it have not tried and failed?

The first and most difficult step for anyone getting into Afghanistan would be to understand and accept that they will be in there for at least 20 years. Though theories on counter-insurgency abound, very few have actually snuffed one out. The second step is to realise that everyone needs allies — India once found an ally in Iran against the Taliban, and today, Russia and the US may also share some of the same goals. The third step, which has proven impossible for India in the past, is to articulate a clear and limited vision behind which these likeminded states might temporarily band.

Moscow Love

Delhi has one potential partner in Moscow. Russia has been torn about US presence in the former Soviet backwaters, but realises the dangers present in a complete Nato withdrawal from Afghanistan. Worried that the country might collapse into civil war and become a hub of narcotics and Islamism, the Russian foreign ministry has announced that it is considering deploying troops along the Tajik-Afghan border. The Kremlin genuinely worries that like in the turbulent 1990s, Islamist ideology might spread to Tajikistan and Uzbekistan, and that drug money might reinvigorate criminal organisations in the region. Under no circumstance, however, will Moscow be drawn into resending troops into the wartorn country.

Russia's leasing of an airbase to Nato forces to assist in logistics and resupply efforts is nonetheless a sign that it is willing to assist in curbing the Taliban's influence. Russia has sold, through the US as well as directly to Kabul, nearly 100 Mi-17 helicopters that can act as a transport as well as a gunship. However, after its own 10-year war with the mujaheddin, extensive Russian aid might not only be politically difficult for Kabul but also unwanted. India can augment Kabul's supply with its own Russian-origin arms and the training of Afghan troops.

Tehran is an old ally in the region that Delhi can turn to. Like Russia, Iran has viewed US presence in Afghanistan with suspicion, so much so that it has been alleged that Tehran is temporarily supporting a low-level insurgency against US interests in the country.

The ayatollahs have maintained close ties with Kabul since the ouster of the Taliban, and contributed to rebuilding Afghanistan. Iran has built roads, dental colleges and libraries in Afghanistan, and in the harsh winter of 2008-09, even supplied oil at below-market rates to help with Kabul's electricity supply. At a humanitarian level, the Imam Khomeini Relief Committee is providing micro-loans, non-cash assistance and even vocational training to families and orphans. Among Tehran's chief cross-border concerns are narcotics and the influx of refugees, already numbering around 2.5 million.

Also please note that , NATO is not completely pulling out of Afghanistan in 2014 and if you reports of 14 Indian consulates are to be true...then i'd say we have considerable influence....
 
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