India - 1.4 billion people

[LASER1]

Just clicked on it, no where does it say Pakistan has 2% forest cover on that page. Need to be more specific.

Lol! That's called basic math. There's forest cover and your land area. Just divide both man, and multiply by 100.

Need more fact

You need to less thick to understand that. It is, a tree cannot grow using Nuclear weapons or too fast. A natural forest takes years.

 

[waz]

@PAKISTANFOREVER please stop posting such posts.

 

[Cobra Arbok]

Did you? Was that in 1960s, 1970s, 1980s, 1990s, 2000s or just yesterday?

I can see you kept your focus on economic growth. After nearly six decades in the lead India took over Pakistan only in about 2008. So one full decade you have been ahead and you have declared victory and race over? The race continues. Unless you have memory of a gold fish you know things can change. India was the butt of jokes for decades and was moving forward so slowly that the term "Hindoo growth" was used to describle a slow ratarded development.

But we certainly will never beat you on the population front. India will be the world's biggest baby making machine and ovetake China soon. You will earn the title "supapowa India". 1,400,000,000 Gangoo's. That is lot of Gangoo's Pakistan has to face.

For most of its Independent history, India tried some failed pseudo-socialist system. Remember Nehru was a die-hard socialist. That may have also been due to India's close ties to the Soviet Union. My dad grew up in the 70s, and he told me India's licensing and non- tariff barriers were so bad, it was almost impossible to buy a can of coke. It wasn't until 1991 that Pm P.V. Narsinha Rao opened up the economy, followed by traditional free-market captitalism of the BJP under Atal Vajpayee. India is actually proof that socialism rarely works for developing economies. While India stagnated, East Asian countries such as Korea and Singapore opened up and embraced capitalism, and transitioned form being some of the poorest countries in the world to the wealthiest. And to think some politicians actually want to bring socialism to the US is ridiculous, but I digress. Pakistan was closer to the US. which is why it opened up sooner. With that being said, the only time Pakistan really outpaced India economically under Zia U:-Haq. That was all thrown away under Bhutto, Shariff, and Musharaf.
Anyway, today the gap is large and expanding rapidly. It could be because the WOT crippled Pakistan. Regardless of the reason, India has been consistently hitting 7-8 percent growth for the past ten years, with only a few quarters of 5-6 percent growth, mostly during the 2009 global recession, and of course immediately following demonetization. Meanwhile it is considered good if Pakistan gets 5%. Even if CPEC finally gets completed, it looks like the gap will never close. With that being said, perhaps a government under someone as capable as IK might be able to make the necessary reforms that could make Pakistan economically comparable to India. We will have to wait and see.

Lol. Take as long as you want. You are going to stay behind. Induranis will never catch up because of the that cesspool

Calm down. you're adding fuel to this trollfest.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

@PAKISTANFOREVER please stop posting such posts.

Sorry bro. Will do.

 

[waz]

If such language used by any Indian, he would have been handed over INSTANT BAN.

Carry on afterall its your forum, your rules.

Shows biased moderation towards Pakistanis vs other Nationalities.

Nope and I have let Indian users get away with such stuff. But anyway carry on.

 

[Cobra Arbok]

@Pluralist I am under no delusion that water crisis is not a major problem that affects both our countries, especially since both have growing population. However, India has the advantage of having naturally fertile land in the gangetic plains, which means it does not require the extensive irrigation system of Pakistan originally bilt by the British. India also has a more reliable monsoon thanks to its mostly subtropical climate. However, India definitely does need reforms on water storage and distribution. My point was that India HAS the capacity to sustain 1.4 billion people, but only if managed correctly. The way things are today, it is clear India is NOT managing its resources in a method necessary to sustain its massive population. But than again, neither is Pakistan, and its population is growing at a faster rate than India.

Nope and I have let Indian users get away with such stuff. But anyway carry on.

I would prefer if you take a stricter stance, even if many Indians get banned(myself included). It is hard to have a constructive discussion because some members insist on trolling and going off-topic(both sides are guilty of this)

 

[Cobra Arbok]

It's all about nukes and killing with you lot isn't it?

Don't forget penises. When guys don't have anything else, they tend to look down.

 

[Bhoot Pishach]

@Pluralist I am under no delusion that water crisis is not a major problem that affects both our countries, especially since both have growing population. However, India has the advantage of having naturally fertile land in the gangetic plains, which means it does not require the extensive irrigation system of Pakistan originally bilt by the British. India also has a more reliable monsoon thanks to its mostly subtropical climate. However, India definitely does need reforms on water storage and distribution. My point was that India HAS the capacity to sustain 1.4 billion people, but only if managed correctly. The way things are today, it is clear India is NOT managing its resources in a method necessary to sustain its massive population. But than again, neither is Pakistan, and its population is growing at a faster rate than India.


I would prefer if you take a stricter stance, even if many Indians get banned(myself included). It is hard to have a constructive discussion because some members insist on trolling and going off-topic(both sides are guilty of this)

But experts are predicting something else. And that is not also very good.

https://tribune.com.pk/story/179236...ncrease-10-pose-serious-threats-future-study/

River Indus flow to increase by 10%, pose serious threats in future: study

By Suhail Yusuf
Published: August 31, 2018

In this file photo, flood affected villagers walk through water in Murredke. PHOTO: AFP

KARACHI: Pakistan will see a 10 per cent increase in mean water flow in River Indus for the period 2046 – 2075, according to a new baseline study and predictions of most authentic climate models.

A team of experts from the Commonwealth Scientific and Industrial Research Organisation (CSIRO) conducted a comprehensive baseline survey of the period 1976–2005 of all 54 rivers of South Asia and used this data in the climate models considered more accurate thus far.

As a result, the future predictions of a wetter South Asia are in consonant with the baseline study of the past. Global warming and climatic change – with more rainfall and enhanced temperatures – are responsible for the projected increase in water flow.

‘Indus delta has shrunk by 92% since 1833’

According to the research, flow of Indus, Ganges and Brahmputra rivers will increase by 10 to 30 per cent annual runoff according to the paper published earlier this month in the Journal of Hydrology: Regional Studies. The mean runoff will increase from 2046 to 2075.

The Ganges – Brahmaputra and Deccan plateau will see a 15 per cent spike in water flow, while 20 per cent increase is projected in Narmada – Tapti basin and Sri Lanka.

PHOTO COURTESY: SCIENCEDIRECT.COM

The imminent increase in water flow of the rivers demands urgent need for a common platform for the South Asian countries to tackle the issue.

Challenges for Pakistan

An increase in River Indus flow even by a small percentage could pose serious challenges for Pakistan. The country’s experts have already warned that rainy period is decreasing in lower parts of the country and increasing in upper areas. Melting of glaciers, heat and evaporation will also lead to increase in flow of River Indus in the future.

Pakistan’s renowned climatologist and main author of the country’s first climate change policy, Dr Qamaruz Zaman Chaudhry says the study indicates increased flow of South Asian rivers, which is in consonant with previously held views of the experts.

“These projections demand scaling up of climate resilient integrated water resource management practices in the South Asia region, one of the most climate vulnerable region globally,” added Chaudhry.

95% of plastic polluting world’s oceans come from just 10 rivers including Indus

Pakistan’s hugely populous districts are directly located in the possible flood regions and increased river flow will be a problem for these areas.

“Developing resilience in agriculture to regular climate shocks is one of the biggest challenges facing our region, as climate change will increase irregular rainfall patterns and increase incidence of floods and droughts,” Chaudhry said.

Scientists used different tools, satellite imagery and field work to collect the best data sets. Then the data was used in Coupled Model Intercomparison Project phase 5 (CMIP5) frame work with some downscaling for the South Asian region.

The CMIP was designed by hundreds of leading experts to predict future aspects of climate change. The first CMIP was devised in 1995 and still updating with more modifications. However, CSIRO experts also use other hydrological models too.

 

[Cobra Arbok]

But experts are predicting something else. And that is not also very good.

https://tribune.com.pk/story/179236...ncrease-10-pose-serious-threats-future-study/

River Indus flow to increase by 10%, pose serious threats in future: study

By Suhail Yusuf
Published: August 31, 2018

In this file photo, flood affected villagers walk through water in Murredke. PHOTO: AFP

KARACHI: Pakistan will see a 10 per cent increase in mean water flow in River Indus for the period 2046 – 2075, according to a new baseline study and predictions of most authentic climate models.

A team of experts from the Commonwealth Scientific and Industrial Research Organisation (CSIRO) conducted a comprehensive baseline survey of the period 1976–2005 of all 54 rivers of South Asia and used this data in the climate models considered more accurate thus far.

As a result, the future predictions of a wetter South Asia are in consonant with the baseline study of the past. Global warming and climatic change – with more rainfall and enhanced temperatures – are responsible for the projected increase in water flow.

‘Indus delta has shrunk by 92% since 1833’

According to the research, flow of Indus, Ganges and Brahmputra rivers will increase by 10 to 30 per cent annual runoff according to the paper published earlier this month in the Journal of Hydrology: Regional Studies. The mean runoff will increase from 2046 to 2075.

The Ganges – Brahmaputra and Deccan plateau will see a 15 per cent spike in water flow, while 20 per cent increase is projected in Narmada – Tapti basin and Sri Lanka.

PHOTO COURTESY: SCIENCEDIRECT.COM

The imminent increase in water flow of the rivers demands urgent need for a common platform for the South Asian countries to tackle the issue.

Challenges for Pakistan

An increase in River Indus flow even by a small percentage could pose serious challenges for Pakistan. The country’s experts have already warned that rainy period is decreasing in lower parts of the country and increasing in upper areas. Melting of glaciers, heat and evaporation will also lead to increase in flow of River Indus in the future.

Pakistan’s renowned climatologist and main author of the country’s first climate change policy, Dr Qamaruz Zaman Chaudhry says the study indicates increased flow of South Asian rivers, which is in consonant with previously held views of the experts.

“These projections demand scaling up of climate resilient integrated water resource management practices in the South Asia region, one of the most climate vulnerable region globally,” added Chaudhry.

95% of plastic polluting world’s oceans come from just 10 rivers including Indus

Pakistan’s hugely populous districts are directly located in the possible flood regions and increased river flow will be a problem for these areas.

“Developing resilience in agriculture to regular climate shocks is one of the biggest challenges facing our region, as climate change will increase irregular rainfall patterns and increase incidence of floods and droughts,” Chaudhry said.

Scientists used different tools, satellite imagery and field work to collect the best data sets. Then the data was used in Coupled Model Intercomparison Project phase 5 (CMIP5) frame work with some downscaling for the South Asian region.

The CMIP was designed by hundreds of leading experts to predict future aspects of climate change. The first CMIP was devised in 1995 and still updating with more modifications. However, CSIRO experts also use other hydrological models too.

Flooding and drought are both equally bad disasters that will face both countries. Water is the giver of life, but can quickly become a bringer of death.

 

[N.Siddiqui]

@Cobra Arbok


For 60-62 years of total 71 years of independence, Pakistan was ahead of India in all human development indices, in fact Pakistan per capita GDP was twice that of India in the 60's...later on bad planning, policies, WOT took that impetus away and the growth curve from Pakistan..it is just a matter of time Pakistan catches up, has all the parameters, resources and need just the right road map ahead, seems things are falling in Places now.

BTW India per capita income ranks it at 131st spot and Pakistan is just slightly behind at 140th or something in the world and per capita income of India is ahead in a minuscule proportion, about 18-20% higher than Pakistan.

The HDI indices, the economy, per capita economy difference between India and Pakistan is small and can easily be bridged the difference between China and India with almost the same population is glaring and big. China economy is about 5 times that of India and their exports are about 10 times that of India...

India need to start comparing and competing with China as the two countries are equal in population sizes, Pakistan is just 15% of India population, yes Pakistan comparing itself with India makes sense as India is a bigger country with bigger economy w.r.t population and size.

 

[itsanufy]

india is 7x bigger than Pakistan and did not have the WOT imposed on it. So $65 billion has WAY more effect on us than would on a nation of 1.4 billion people.

CEPEC I believe started on 2013, probably will complete by 2022 if not later. So 9 years, FDI 65B (Actually 62B). Now for each year you have little more than than 6B of FDI. We have 7 times population. Prorated it will be 42B. But it was 61B.
Anyway it was not my point, you see economically for China trade with India is more profitable than Pakistan. Any harm to India will be a loss for her.

 

[Shamsher1990]

India has almost twice as much population density as Pakistan

Crazy place

But then Pakistan has only places with water around indus.

See the green zone along the river? Thats the only place with enough water to support agriculture. The densely populated areas of India UP and Bihar actually have a lot of water and furtile land. So effectively comparable state to Entire Pakistan is may be Rajasthan and Gujarat.

Rajasthan has 201 people per sq km. While Gujrat has about 300 people per square km.

@Cobra Arbok


For 60-62 years of total 71 years of independence, Pakistan was ahead of India in all human development indices, in fact Pakistan per capita GDP was twice that of India in the 60's...later on bad planning, policies, WOT took that impetus away and the growth curve from Pakistan..it is just a matter of time Pakistan catches up, has all the parameters, resources and need just the right road map ahead, seems things are falling in Places now.

BTW India per capita income ranks it at 131st spot and Pakistan is just slightly behind at 140th or something in the world and per capita income of India is ahead in a minuscule proportion, about 18-20% higher than Pakistan.

The HDI indices, the economy, per capita economy difference between India and Pakistan is small and can easily be bridged the difference between China and India with almost the same population is glaring and big. China economy is about 5 times that of India and their exports are about 10 times that of India...

India need to start comparing and competing with China as the two countries are equal in population sizes, Pakistan is just 15% of India population, yes Pakistan comparing itself with India makes sense as India is a bigger country with bigger economy w.r.t population and size.

For that period, India actually worked on something else. Land reforms and a socialistic system to promote equality. That is to make everyone equally poor. While Pakistan didn't implement any land reforms and went the path of capitalistic system. The real economic focus in India began in 1991. Needless to say, they have not looked back since then.

 

[Jackdaws]

@Cobra Arbok


For 60-62 years of total 71 years of independence, Pakistan was ahead of India in all human development indices, in fact Pakistan per capita GDP was twice that of India in the 60's...later on bad planning, policies, WOT took that impetus away and the growth curve from Pakistan..it is just a matter of time Pakistan catches up, has all the parameters, resources and need just the right road map ahead, seems things are falling in Places now.

BTW India per capita income ranks it at 131st spot and Pakistan is just slightly behind at 140th or something in the world and per capita income of India is ahead in a minuscule proportion, about 18-20% higher than Pakistan.

The HDI indices, the economy, per capita economy difference between India and Pakistan is small and can easily be bridged the difference between China and India with almost the same population is glaring and big. China economy is about 5 times that of India and their exports are about 10 times that of India...

India need to start comparing and competing with China as the two countries are equal in population sizes, Pakistan is just 15% of India population, yes Pakistan comparing itself with India makes sense as India is a bigger country with bigger economy w.r.t population and size.

I am curious - do these statistics include East Pakistan upto 1971? Because from I understand there was a huge disparity between the two wings.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

CEPEC I believe started on 2013, probably will complete by 2022 if not later. So 9 years, FDI 65B (Actually 62B). Now for each year you have little more than than 6B of FDI. We have 7 times population. Prorated it will be 42B. But it was 61B.
Anyway it was not my point, you see economically for China trade with India is more profitable than Pakistan. Any harm to India will be a loss for her.

CPEC started in 2015. There is no time limit on CPEC. It is a continuous, pervasive economic idea, not a set finite economic program. It involves every part of the Pakistani state. CPEC will ultimately amalgamate the Pakistan economy with that of China. This is all but set to grow as Pakistan's relationship/alliance with China gets stronger with the passage of time.

PS if the Chinese were concerned with profit from trade with india, they would not have assisted in Pakistan becoming a nuclear weapons state. That is a false dichotomy.

 

[N.Siddiqui]

For that period, India actually worked on something else. Land reforms and a socialistic system to promote equality. That is to make everyone equally poor. While Pakistan didn't implement any land reforms and went the path of capitalistic system. The real economic focus in India began in 1991. Needless to say, they have not looked back since then.

Land reforms was a complete failure in India and looks good only on paper, Pakistan has land reforms started in 1958, much successful...again started under Bhutto, not very effective and restarted under Zia as well.



India has the largest number of rural poor as well as landless households in the world. Landlessness is a strong indicator of rural poverty in the country. Land is most valuable (for) ...economic independence, social status and a modest and permanent means of livelihood ...identity and dignity and ...opportunities for realising social equality.


IMPACT ON LANDLESSNESS
It is hardly surprising therefore that the cumulative impact of all these measures of land reform on rural landlessness has been negligible. The Draft Land Reforms Policy, using National Sample Survey Office (nsso) data (2003-04), notes that while one-third of all rural households are landless, those near to landlessness (less than 0.4 hectares) add up one-third more. The next 20% hold less than 1 hectare. In other words, 60% of the country’s population has rights over only 5% of the country’s land, whereas 10% of the population has control over 55% of the land (DLRP 2013). Even admitting that the data from 2003-04 is not strictly comparable to NSSO 1992, Rawal (2008) suggests that it shows an increase of as much as 6 percentage points in landlessness, while inequality in landownership also increased.

To the small extent that land reforms have actually been implemented on the ground, what has been its impact on the lives of those who received land allotments ? Many field studies show that while the possession of land added to their social standing and self-confidence, very often they were unable to cultivate it because supporting credit or grants were not available for land development and input costs (Iyer 1997).

This depressing history of the nearly failed project of land reforms in India and its negligible impact on rural poverty and landlessness is familiar both to scholars and administrators. In the light of this, what optimism can there be about the new Draft Land Reform Policy ?