HESA Fighter Kowsar Program - Current and Next Generation

[drmeson]

Lets discuss Kowsar's, current and future prospects with proper info slides.

Specification with confirmed and probable Local integrations.

Airframe

Engine

Cockpit & Radar

Avionics

Some new and previous testing photos on Saegeh.

Air-Air + ECM

Air-Ground

 

[drmeson]

Azarakhsh (Total Test Bed for change in internal systems) =>
Saeghe I/II (Massive changes in Aerodynamics) =>
Kowsar (98% domestically built with 4.0 gen suite) =>
Next Gen ... The real deal for production

with upgraded F-14AM+Fakour, Mig-29M/SMT (if upgraded + just 2-3 squadrons procured), NextGen Kowsar can guard the Iranian airspace pretty well and carry IRIAF into the era of unmanned combat aviation. We are very strong in that department already.

 

[aryobarzan]

Azarakhsh (Total Test Bed for change in internal systems) =>
Saeghe I/II (Massive changes in Aerodynamics) =>
Kowsar (98% domestically built with 4.0 gen suite) =>
Next Gen ... The real deal for production

with upgraded F-14AM+Fakour, Mig-29M/SMT (if upgraded + just 2-3 squadrons procured), NextGen Kowsar can guard the Iranian airspace pretty well and carry IRIAF into the era of unmanned combat aviation. We are very strong in that department already.

You did not include the ejection seat and the landing gear...each one of those items in any aircraft takes a whole new company to design and build in the western countries...

 

[drmeson]

You did not include the ejection seat and the landing gear...each one of those items in any aircraft takes a whole new company to design and build in the western countries...

Ejection seat info is there in the slide on top right, but I don't have the pics of it. I know it was unveiled and has been presented in airshows. In case you have it please post it here. I have this pic though from the testing.

Same for the wheels, please find the pics so we have a new slide

 

[drmeson]

@Hack-Hook @PersianNinja @mohsen @SOHEIL @PDF @IranDefence @sahureka2 @aryobarzan @waz @sanel1412 @QWECXZ @_Nabil_ @925boy @zartosht

 

[BlessedKingOfLonging]

I know engine development takes time but why not just steal the blueprints? India manufactures the AL-31FP (Su-30 MKI) in-house, Turkey has licensed production for F-110-GE-110 (F-16 C/D) and South Korea makes F-100 PW-229s domestically (F-15 K).

Just hack the first two nations yourself or contract North Korea to steal it from South Korea and voila

 

[zartosht]

Aerial warfare is going under its most dramatic transformation since ww2. In my opinion, conventional manned warplanes will be obsolete soon.

I remember barely 10 years ago, everyone and their mothers were mocking Iran for heavily investing in drones and ucavs. first Iran was doing it out of desperation because it couldnt get airplanes. Then it was that Iran was incapable of making UCAVs, as this magic alien technology (that was invented by Iran) Can only be produced by the white men.

After Iran produced it, it became a case of "oh its just a toy, only wunderwaff americans and white man UCAVs are real"

I think the most decisive drone attack in military history was the ones the 'houthis' did that shut down half of saudi oil production in a single strike.

not only was it absolutely crippling, but it showed how much superior drones were actually to fighter aircraft. Sending attacking fighters into an enemy that has their air defenses up fully is suicide, a declaration of war, and risks hundred million dollar planes + priceless trained pilots.

a drone can do all that, without any of the risks involved/negatives..

 

[drmeson]

I know engine development takes time but why not just steal the blueprints? India manufactures the AL-31FP (Su-30 MKI) in-house, Turkey has licensed production for F-110-GE-110 (F-16 C/D) and South Korea makes F-100 PW-229s domestically (F-15 K).

Just hack the first two nations yourself or contract North Korea to steal it from South Korea and voila

Going by what we actually know we are going in the direction of a larger very sophisticated single-crystal Turbofan for next-gen fighter in this Azarakhsh-Saeqeh-Kowsar R&D series.

Jahesh-700 is a single-crystal turbofan ... similar to FJ33 whose larger version is FJ44-4A, with a dry thurst of 3600 lbf. If OWJ may enlarge Jahesh-700 to FJ-44-4A size, its afterburner might produce something like 7500-8000 lbf. 2x those on Kowsar with more composite use than the current version will result in a 15000 lbf powering a supersonic BVR-AESA combo fighter with RCS of 1 m2. Pretty similar to an F-CK-1 C/D or fighter version of the AIDC T-5.

FJ-44's dia is 20-21 inches while that of OWJ J-90 or original J-85 is 20 inches so they are almost interchangeable. Not much of a heavy redesign is required but may require a redesign of air intakes which we already have experimented in Saeqeh.

 

[drmeson]

Aerial warfare is going under its most dramatic transformation since ww2. In my opinion, conventional manned warplanes will be obsolete soon.

I remember barely 10 years ago, everyone and their mothers were mocking Iran for heavily investing in drones and ucavs. first Iran was doing it out of desperation because it couldnt get airplanes. Then it was that Iran was incapable of making UCAVs, as this magic alien technology (that was invented by Iran) Can only be produced by the white men.

After Iran produced it, it became a case of "oh its just a toy, only wunderwaff americans and white man UCAVs are real"

I think the most decisive drone attack in military history was the ones the 'houthis' did that shut down half of saudi oil production in a single strike.

not only was it absolutely crippling, but it showed how much superior drones were actually to fighter aircraft. Sending attacking fighters into an enemy that has their air defenses up fully is suicide, a declaration of war, and risks hundred million dollar planes + priceless trained pilots.

a drone can do all that, without any of the risks involved/negatives..

Current combat aviation seems to be in transition with the following constituents

-Manned platforms+LR-BVR+SOWs
-MALE UCAVS + Loitering Swarms
-AWACS+SIGNIT+OTHR
-LORAD's + SHORADs

We are in the right direction

-Manned platforms+LR-BVR+SOWs => F-14AM+MIG-29(upgrade)+NextGen Kowsar+ SU35S (purchase)
-MALE UCAVS + Loitering Swarms => MALE Shahed 129/Gaza/Kaman-22 + Shahed 171/181191 + Shahed 136 Loiterings
-AWACS+SIGNIT+OTHR => Sepeher OTHR + multple ground AESA radar operating on datalink
-LORAD's + SHORADs => Bavar 373+S-300+Talash/Khordad+TorM1/M2+Pantsir

we just need to focus on domestic production of Nextgen Kowsar with combat suite of a 4+ or 4++ generation that we can produce domestically in numbers like 200+. They will complement our future UCAV fleet and AD in aerial defense. We have the ever-growing arsenal of BM/CM and UCAVs for strike missions so IRIAF's job is to just take care of Iranian skies and that is it.

 

[Beast]

The twin cannon no more exist, right?

 

[drmeson]

The twin cannon no more exist, right?

yes it's gone to make space for larger radar+ modern avionics, section has been heavily redesigned, and to compensate for that different weight distribution in the airframe has to be incorporated

 

[Indos]

I know engine development takes time but why not just steal the blueprints? India manufactures the AL-31FP (Su-30 MKI) in-house, Turkey has licensed production for F-110-GE-110 (F-16 C/D) and South Korea makes F-100 PW-229s domestically (F-15 K).

Just hack the first two nations yourself or contract North Korea to steal it from South Korea and voila

No, India, Turkey, and South Korea dont manufactures those engine. They are more assembler and make some parts.

There is no dumb engine manufacturer in the West and Russia will let that to happen just because you guys buy that engine quite many.

Latest order for F 414 for India Tejas Mark2 doesnt event involve India industry despite the order is about 100

 

[BlessedKingOfLonging]

Going by what we actually know we are going in the direction of a larger very sophisticated single-crystal Turbofan for next-gen fighter in this Azarakhsh-Saeqeh-Kowsar R&D series.

Jahesh-700 is a single-crystal turbofan ... similar to FJ33 whose larger version is FJ44-4A, with a dry thurst of 3600 lbf. If OWJ may enlarge Jahesh-700 to FJ-44-4A size, its afterburner might produce something like 7500-8000 lbf. 2x those on Kowsar with more composite use than the current version will result in a 15000 lbf powering a supersonic BVR-AESA combo fighter with RCS of 1 m2. Pretty similar to an F-CK-1 C/D or fighter version of the AIDC T-5.

FJ-44's dia is 20-21 inches while that of OWJ J-90 or original J-85 is 20 inches so they are almost interchangeable. Not much of a heavy redesign is required but may require a redesign of air intakes which we already have experimented in Saeqeh.

Why not instead reverse engineer the RD-33 and use it as a stop-gap measure in the new fighter until an Iranian turbofan of a superior quality is ready? I mean don't get me wrong - I want the FJ-44 clone to happen but it would be a better fit on an advanced trainer rather than a frontline aircraft.

No, India, Turkey, and South Korea dont manufactures those engine. They are more assembler and make some parts.

There is no dumb engine manufacturer in the West and Russia will let that to happen just because you guys buy that engine quite many.

Latest order for F 414 for India AMCA doesnt event involve India industry despite the order is about 100

I may be completely wrong about India and Turkey but I'm fairly certain South Korea builds it's entire F-15K fleet at home with technology transfers, not mere assembly. There was controversy regarding it in the past but USA eventually relented and gave them the blueprints and the license.

 

[Indos]

I may be completely wrong about India and Turkey but I'm fairly certain South Korea builds it's entire F-15K fleet at home with technology transfers, not mere assembly. There was controversy regarding it in the past but USA eventually relented and gave them the blueprints and the license.

Turkey and South Korea has more possibility indeed to make some parts on the engine due to their Joint Venture with American company ( TEI is owned partially with GE from USA-Hanwa also has joint venture with GE from USA ).

Many people talk about engine production but it is actually assembling and some parts manufacturing as I have detail data for Turkey F 110 engine production and also about South Korea what I know is that they will make some part for F 414 but those parts are the ones that are not critical, despite Hanwa Korea, unlike India, has become part of supply chain for civilian Western airplane engine.

 

[Mahabahu kaunteya]

Turkey and South Korea has more possibility indeed to make some parts on the engine due to their Joint Venture with American company ( TEI is owned partially with GE from USA-Hanwa also has joint venture with GE from USA ).

Many people talk about engine production but it is actually assembling and some parts manufacturing as I have detail data for Turkey F 110 engine production and also about South Korea what I know is that they will make some part for F 414 but those parts are the ones that are not critical, despite Hanwa Korea, unlike India, has become part of supply chain for civilian Western airplane engine.

I won't dispute this , engine development is strangely a very daunting task to be honest.
India is in process to develop engines jointly with either safaran or rolls Royce for amca and tejas mk 2