First Project-15B Bangalore-class DDG hull : satellite pics

[Dillinger]

@Dillinger - No RBU-6000s on P-15B?

Yes there are.

So far:-

48 cells for LR-SAM (Whether 8 or 8ER no info)
16 cells for AShMs
2 Kavach chaff dispensers
2 Mareech ATDS dispensers
No change is VSR, the model tender issued by MDL still sticks with the RAWL-02 VSR/ASR (which is the BIG disappointment).

My own opinion, strictly in the realm of jingos, the 8ER and a proper solid state L-band VSR will make it capable of taking on ALL comers and bring parity with the competition.

@he-man Although there is another little MDL document (not news article by some yellow journo, I mean MDL's own release) that hints at 64 cells for the LR-SAM, which as I stated is an option and quite possible.

 

[The A-5]

Yes there are.

So far:-

48 cells for LR-SAM (Whether 8 or 8ER no info)
16 cells for AShMs
2 Kavach chaff dispensers
2 Mareech ATDS dispensers
No change is VSR, the model tender issued by MDL still sticks with the RAWL-02 VSR/ASR (which is the BIG disappointment).

My own opinion, strictly in the realm of jingos, the 8ER and a proper solid state L-band VSR will make it capable of taking on ALL comers and bring parity with the competition.

Sir, one thing I need clarification about - if P-15A indeed has space reserved to add another 32 VLS cells for B8 in future if
IN so requires, and that there is no major difference between 15A and 15B in terms of structure (save for flushed deck maybe), so does this mean both 15A and 15B can be retrofitted to have 64 Barak-8 VLS if need be?

I seriously hope 2 of the 30mm gun slots get replaced with 32 x Maitri PDMS as soon as possible - that would equal
a total of 96 missiles carried on each ship even with just 48 Barak-8s and only then can a number-crunching fanboy like me sleep in peace.

AND I JUST WONDER IF IT'S POSSIBLE TO FIT BARAK-8 VLS UNITS IN THE SLOTS OF 30MM GUNS INSTEAD
OF PUTTING BARAK-1/MAITRI CELLS? In case we end up with a gun-missile combined CIWS (where everything is on
same mount) and decide to settle for just 2 of them instead of 4 on each ship.

 

[he-man]

Yes there are.

So far:-

48 cells for LR-SAM (Whether 8 or 8ER no info)
16 cells for AShMs
2 Kavach chaff dispensers
2 Mareech ATDS dispensers
No change is VSR, the model tender issued by MDL still sticks with the RAWL-02 VSR/ASR (which is the BIG disappointment).

My own opinion, strictly in the realm of jingos, the 8ER and a proper solid state L-band VSR will make it capable of taking on ALL comers and bring parity with the competition.

@he-man Although there is another little MDL document (not news article by some yellow journo, I mean MDL's own release) that hints at 64 cells for the LR-SAM, which as I stated is an option and quite possible.

Chinese had a similar volume search radar in type 052d,,,guess they have gone on to l band aesa now

Type 517M L band long range radar

 

[Dillinger]

Sir, one thing I need clarification about - if P-15A indeed has space reserved to add another 32 VLS cells for B8 in future if
IN so requires, and that there is no major difference between 15A and 15B in terms of structure (save for flushed deck maybe), so does this mean both 15A and 15B can be retrofitted to have 64 Barak-8 VLS if need be?

I seriously hope 2 of the 30mm gun slots get replaced with 32 x Maitri PDMS as soon as possible - that would equal
a total of 96 missiles carried on each ship even with just 48 Barak-8s and only then can a number-crunching fanboy like me sleep in peace.

AND I JUST WONDER IF IT'S POSSIBLE TO FIT BARAK-8 VLS UNITS IN THE SLOTS OF 30MM GUNS INSTEAD
OF PUTTING BARAK-1/MAITRI CELLS? In case we end up with a gun-missile combined CIWS (where everything is on
same mount) and decide to settle for just 2 of them instead of 4 on each ship.

It can be done but one VLU of the 8s will take up the space equivalent to 2 VLUs of the 1s.

And it is not necessary to do so.

As I have stated in this thread and in the one dealing with the 15A, there is space which has been left for retro-fitment, this space CAN be used for additional VLU, the operative word is "CAN", whether that will be done or not no one knows, even if the 15As were to see such retro-fitment it would occur later in the NEXT DECADE.

The number of LR-SAM is not that important after a point of time, 48 or even 32 LR-SAM is adequate, it is the sensor fitment that should worry the IN if they wish to keep these ships relevant for long.

 

[he-man]

Yup they got the l-band aesa

While we under some mysterious circumstances thought this was enough.........

 

[Dillinger]

Yup they got the l-band aesa

While we under some mysterious circumstances thought this was enough.........

A particularly impressive indigenous effort, I would not want to trade a SMART-L for it but its what it is.

 

[spectribution]

And u seem to be oblivious to them somehow
And i know u hate chinese but be reasonable, man



That was the whole point,,,,we have no data to prove the superiority of barak-8 and inferiority of chinese inventory.
So we should skip the part,,,we just cannot compare

Barak 8 I know as IAI advertises it. Chinese missiles are based on russian ones so basic characteristic never changes.

HHQ 9 -> S 300M
HHQ 16 -> Buk Missile

As for me hating Chinese, never! They are also normal people and very industrious ones! However I always check facts, and this time facts and hype don't check out.

Yup they got the l-band aesa

While we under some mysterious circumstances thought this was enough.........

A particularly impressive indigenous effort, I would not want to trade a SMART-L for it but its what it is.

We can get it done but focus should be on more ships and better equipment. RAN 40L may be negotiated.

 

[Dillinger]

Barak 8 I know as IAI advertises it. Chinese missiles are based on russian ones so basic characteristic never changes.

HHQ 9 -> S 300M
HHQ 16 -> Buk Missile

As for me hating Chinese, never! They are also normal people and very industrious ones! However I always check facts, and this time facts and hype don't check out.




We can get it done but focus should be on more ships and better equipment. RAN 40L may be negotiated.

MDL disagrees with the RAN-40L speculations, at least the models they have commissioned do. After that its all up to the IN.

 

[he-man]

Barak 8 I know as IAI advertises it. Chinese missiles are based on russian ones so basic characteristic never changes.

HHQ 9 -> S 300M
HHQ 16 -> Buk Missile

As for me hating Chinese, never! They are also normal people and very industrious ones! However I always check facts, and this time facts and hype don't check out.

Barak-8 advert is no hard fact,,,sorry to burst ur bubble.

As for china copying russian missiles,,,well they are now modifying most of russian radars with their own.Even in s-300 batteries or hq series they have made some good progress.

How much,,no idea.
Point is 055 is no slouch and sitting duck like u are claiming

 

[Dillinger]

@Penguin @The A-5 @Omega007 @he-man @spectribution

For the 64 cell LR-SAM/SAM arrangement.

Like I had said, there is space for another 16 VLU even on the Bs.

Still feeling no love on the VSR though.

Thales Nederlands and TASL had "jointly" offered the SMART-L for the IN, seems like it was not taken up.

http://www.mazagondock.gov.in/newsite2010/pdfs/ots_jully14/Tender Doc 6000000437.pdf

TATA ADVANCED SYSTEMS

 

[he-man]

@Penguin @The A-5 @Omega007 @he-man @spectribution

For the 64 cell LR-SAM/SAM arrangement.

Like I had said, there is space for another 16 VLU even on the Bs.

Still feeling no love on the VSR though.

Thales Nederlands and TASL had "jointly" offered the SMART-L for the IN, seems like it was not taken up.

http://www.mazagondock.gov.in/newsite2010/pdfs/ots_jully14/Tender Doc 6000000437.pdf

TATA ADVANCED SYSTEMS

Ok a very small question here
Why the hell don't we fit the l-star on this ship??

Or modify it to be used here,,i mean whats stopping it??

 

[spectribution]

Barak-8 advert is no hard fact,,,sorry to burst ur bubble.

As for china copying russian missiles,,,well they are now modifying most of russian radars with their own.Even in s-300 batteries or hq series they have made some good progress.

How much,,no idea.
Point is 055 is no slouch and sitting duck like u are claiming

Are you dumb? Who said sitting duck? I said we have capable weapons as well to deal with such "issues".

Barak 8 is DESIGNED TO COUNTER P 800 class missile!

Israeli Navy installs Barak-8 system to counter Russia’s Yakhont missiles | OSNet Daily

http://www.iai.co.il/2013/34408-36713-en/IAI.aspx

BARAK-8 Air & Missile Defense System

Naval and based, short to long range, point & area

Main Features Naval Implementation:

• From supersonic skimmers to high altitude targets by all weather
• Multiple simulataneous engagements in severe saturation scenarios
• Stand-Alone data link optimizing task forces and missiles coordination
• Vertical launch active missile, easily fitting on existing or new ships

Barak-8 meets and exceeds performance of other similar defense systems, while maintaining unique advantages:

• A flexible dual pulse motor system provides high maneuver capability at target interception range throughout Barak-8's wide envelope.
• Low weight and small size (about half of similar systems!) – for small impact on carrying ship.
• Low signatures (carry, launch & flight) – for high ship survivability.
• Safe ship carry & launch – with a small missile and proven vertical launcher concept.
• Robust multi-missile coexistence and multi-target capability (supported by seeker, DL & WCS) – enables operation in highly saturated operational scenarios.
• High performance warhead - robust kill mechanism

Also modify a radar doesn't make the missile anything special. Even India uses Rajendra PESA for Akash. Can it beat patriot missile in air defence?

Nonsense!

@Penguin @The A-5 @Omega007 @he-man @spectribution

For the 64 cell LR-SAM/SAM arrangement.

Like I had said, there is space for another 16 VLU even on the Bs.

Still feeling no love on the VSR though.

Thales Nederlands and TASL had "jointly" offered the SMART-L for the IN, seems like it was not taken up.

http://www.mazagondock.gov.in/newsite2010/pdfs/ots_jully14/Tender Doc 6000000437.pdf

TATA ADVANCED SYSTEMS

That means 64 LRSAM on the P 15B?

 

[Dillinger]

Ok a very small question here
Why the hell don't we fit the l-star on this ship??

Or modify it to be used here,,i mean whats stopping it??

Lolwa, sardaron ke naam pe laalchan laga hi de!

S-band radar hai woh!

Might as well fit an Arudhra then since we did the same with the land based 3DCAR for the Revathi.

@spectribution It is ONE POSSIBLE design/model.arrangement.

IF the IN really wanted to it could opt even for 64 LR-SAM cells (AND NO! NOT THE PSK DRIVEL ABOUT SPARE ROUNDS FOR RELOADS, PLEASE DO NOT TAKE THIS TO MEAN THAT) and 32 SR-SAM cells with 16 AShM cells and 2 CIWS guns, 2 Mareech launchers, 2 Kavach dispensers, 2 RBUs, 4 torp tubes.

 

[he-man]

Are you dumb? Who said sitting duck? I said we have capable weapons as well to deal with such "issues".

Barak 8 is DESIGNED TO COUNTER P 800 class missile!

Israeli Navy installs Barak-8 system to counter Russia’s Yakhont missiles | OSNet Daily

http://www.iai.co.il/2013/34408-36713-en/IAI.aspx

BARAK-8 Air & Missile Defense System

Naval and based, short to long range, point & area

Main Features Naval Implementation:

• From supersonic skimmers to high altitude targets by all weather
• Multiple simulataneous engagements in severe saturation scenarios
• Stand-Alone data link optimizing task forces and missiles coordination
• Vertical launch active missile, easily fitting on existing or new ships

Barak-8 meets and exceeds performance of other similar defense systems, while maintaining unique advantages:

• A flexible dual pulse motor system provides high maneuver capability at target interception range throughout Barak-8's wide envelope.
• Low weight and small size (about half of similar systems!) – for small impact on carrying ship.
• Low signatures (carry, launch & flight) – for high ship survivability.
• Safe ship carry & launch – with a small missile and proven vertical launcher concept.
• Robust multi-missile coexistence and multi-target capability (supported by seeker, DL & WCS) – enables operation in highly saturated operational scenarios.
• High performance warhead - robust kill mechanism

Also modify a radar doesn't make the missile anything special. Even India uses Rajendra PESA for Akash. Can it beat patriot missile in air defence?

Nonsense!



That means 64 LRSAM on the P 15B?

And stop behaving like a child.

In case u missed we have an antique radar here to worry first compared to their solid state aesa.
Thats proven to be inferior to chinese one many times over unlike ur claims of barak-8 which are at best speculations.

So i think we better focus on weaknesses here as we agree barak-8 is better than what chinese have at least in accuracy,,,in range we are no where even close

Lolwa, sardaron ke naam pe laalchan laga hi de!

S-band radar hai woh!

Might as well fit an Arudhra then since we did the same with the land based 3DCAR for the Revathi.

@spectribution It is ONE POSSIBLE design/model.arrangement.

IF the IN really wanted to it could opt even for 64 LR-SAM cells (AND NO! NOT THE PSK DRIVEL ABOUT SPARE ROUNDS FOR RELOADS, PLEASE DO NOT TAKE THIS TO MEAN THAT) and 32 SR-SAM cells with 16 AShM cells and 2 CIWS guns, 2 Mareech launchers, 2 Kavach dispensers, 2 RBUs, 4 torp tubes.

Dammit................should have checked first
Koi nai,,

 

[spectribution]

And stop behaving like a child.

In case u missed we have an antique radar here to worry first compared to their solid state aesa.
Thats proven to be inferior to chinese one many times over unlike ur claims of barak-8 which are at best speculations.

So i think we better focus on weaknesses here as we agree barak-8 is better than what chinese have at least in accuracy,,,in range we are no where even close

I gave you a f$%^&*( link man! Range I give a damn. If my ship can survive a missile hit I'm happy.

Lolwa, sardaron ke naam pe laalchan laga hi de!

S-band radar hai woh!

Might as well fit an Arudhra then since we did the same with the land based 3DCAR for the Revathi.

@spectribution It is ONE POSSIBLE design/model.arrangement.

IF the IN really wanted to it could opt even for 64 LR-SAM cells (AND NO! NOT THE PSK DRIVEL ABOUT SPARE ROUNDS FOR RELOADS, PLEASE DO NOT TAKE THIS TO MEAN THAT) and 32 SR-SAM cells with 16 AShM cells and 2 CIWS guns, 2 Mareech launchers, 2 Kavach dispensers, 2 RBUs, 4 torp tubes.

Then why does MDL want the model? Definitely for some expo right?