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China imports losing ground in India

Do you seriously having a reading comprehension problem?

In the first post of the thread itself it says, Anil ambani owned reliance ordered from china( not becos of quality of machinery) but becos of availability of cheap loans that he cant get elsewhere in the world.

If chinese loans are on par with other countries, then no on will buy sub-standard equipment from you. Your manufacturers are compensating the sub-standard quality with cheap loans and mass delivery.

As a matter of fact, many indian power producers that ordered chinese power equipment are now crying everytime the machine breaks down.Soon this Anil ambani will realise what a waste of money he did.

ITs like smart investors when you compare the two brothers Anil and Mukesh. Mukesh ordered most of his refinery equipment from Indian manufacturers and they hardly break and he and his company reaping the benifits, while Anil known for him arrogance and foolishness suffering big time :D

The only edge that Chinese had over Indian manufacturers is offering equipment on loans(and that too cheap loans) and mass delivery( because of a head-start in the production systems).

Prove it.

Sorry, BHEL's average plant load factor is only 70%. Your manager tried to say China's was only 60%, but Reliance, who actually owns the Chinese turbines, came around and smacked him down and said "No it's 90%". That backfired and now everyone knows BHEL's quality is far inferior to Shanghai Electric's.

That's the intellectual dishonesty of Indian businessmen. When they cannot compete, they slander competitors. You're lucky that Shanghai Electric isn't suing BHEL for libel and defamation.
 
^we all kno the standard and quality of Chinese stuff..even if you say false 1000 times it won't become true, first get you house right and earn some reputation in terms of quality of goods and services...even a THIRD WORLD country like ours has realized this fact.
 
Prove it.

Sorry, BHEL's average plant load factor is only 70%. Your manager tried to say China's was only 60%, but Reliance, who actually owns the Chinese turbines, came around and smacked him down and said "No it's 90%". That backfired and now everyone knows BHEL's quality is far inferior to Shanghai Electric's.

That's the intellectual dishonesty of Indian businessmen. When they cannot compete, they slander competitors. You're lucky that Shanghai Electric isn't suing BHEL for libel and defamation.
you prove what you said about reliance thing of 90% ,dont keep ranting asking others for proof............back your claims first...
 
i will give you recent news....................companies who trusted the chinese quality are getting their a$$es whipped..........
Chinese imports no cause for concern: Bhel
BS Reporter / Chennai/ Hyderabad Apr 07, 2012, 00:27 IST
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The earlier concern of Chinese competition in power generation equipment seems fast receding as many customers were cancelling the orders placed with Chinese firms and were coming back to Bharat Heavy Electricals Limited (Bhel), said RK Wanchoo, executive director of the RC Puram unit of the state-owned heavy power equipment manufacturer.

“This is happening due to both quality and service issues,” Wanchoo told reporters at the annual press briefing here on Thursday.
n addition to the pricing advantage that encouraged Indian power developers to look for power plant equipment from China, the capacity constraints of Bhel in coping with the huge spurt in demand from new projects also drove them towards overseas alternatives, he said.
Without specifying the number or names of the power developers, Wanchoo said a large number of customers had redirected their orders to Bhel after cancelling the earlier orders placed with Chinese firms.

Stating that operation and maintenance (O&M) was the crucial input power plants required for at least the next 25 years of the plant life, he said project developers were choosing Bhel not only for its equipment quality but also the reliable and extensive network of its aftersale services.

Above all, the company produces custom-made power plant equipment, he said.

The allround slowdown in execution of power projects across the country due to coal linkage and environmental clearance issues had in a way also worked in its favour as the rush for early delivery of equipment subsided. There was no instance of delay in delivery schedules reported during the year, according to him.

Voluntary requests for postponement of some delivery schedules saw the RC Puram unit clock moderate sales revenues of Rs 7,072 crore in 2011-12. Yet, the factory fully utilised the manufacturing capacity during the year, according to him. The unit has an order book worth Rs 15,000 crore to be delivered in the next 24 months.

Besides, foreign orders have almost dried up for the unit with exports accounting for only about Rs 200 crore during the last financial year.

“Exports used to have 20 per cent share in out annual revenues. This has drastically come down because there is no significant capacity expansion happening outside India and China,” Wanchoo said.

Despite the moderate growth in total revenues, the company was able to increase the gross profit by 38 per cent, mainly by bringing down the material costs by 2 percentage points to 60 per cent among other cost-saving measures, according to him.

Chinese imports no cause for concern: Bhel

now i know what you would say,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,this was because of the pressure from GOI:meeting:
 
China's exports and imports both suffered a sharp drop in growth last month, according to official data released yesterday, raising concerns about the resilience of the Chinese economy and adding pressure for the government to loosen policy and boost growth.

Exports rose 4.9 percent in April from a year earlier, well below market expectations of 8.5 percent, and down from growth of 8.9 percent in March.

Imports rose 0.3 percent, below market expectations of 10.9 percent and March's 5.3 percent increase.

The trade surplus also widened to $18.4 billion, up from 5.4 billion in March.

"The weak export data showed the effective exchange rate of the yuan may now be too high and may be seriously restraining the country's exports," Lu Zhengwei, chief economist with Shanghai-based Industrial Bank, told the Global Times.

"We need either to adjust the exchange rate in proper response to the market, or issue fiscal policies to stimulate growth, which may ease the external and internal pressure in the short term," Lu said.

Signs of weak exports emerged last week when data from the Canton Fair showed export deals signed at the fair dropped by 2.3 percent year-on-year, the first decline for the semiannual event's spring session since 2009.

"The government is expected to boost exports by adjusting the export tax rebate rate, stabilizing the exchange rate and providing more financial support to export-oriented companies," Li Huiyong, chief analyst at Shanghai-based Shenyin Wanguo Research & Consulting, told the Global Times.

"The dramatic drop of imports underlined the weakness of demand and slower-than-expected economic growth. We need also to speed up construction of water conservancy, railway and environment protection projects and low-income housing, as well as boosting investment in infrastructure to spur growth," Li said.

Lu Ting, an economist with Bank of America-Merrill Lynch, also attributed the weak trade growth in April to an unfavorable base effect. "Trade growth in March/April 2011 was unusually strong, partly due to the Japanese earthquake in March 2011," Lu noted.

"Rising oil prices earlier this year lowered new demand and started to show in import data due to the lag between orders and customs clearance," he said.

Trade growth is also expected to rebound as the base effect wears off and growth momentum picks up, Lu noted.
China?s April exports, imports fall below expectations - People's Daily Online

:lol: didnt i said we dont take offence/cheap tricks from china puppets....:lol: the real game begins only now....hahaha....:lol:
 
Consider this: ITC sourced 100% of its stationery products like pencils, geometry boxes and scholastic products marketed under Classmate brand from China. But imports will fall below 10% this year as the Indian behemoth moves sourcing back to India in a big way.

This is great news for both India and China. It means 2 things: China is moving up the Value Chain, and India's finally starting the first parts of industrialization.
 
Not really. It's mostly India's obsession with "retaking lost land" and making the Indian Ocean India's Ocean, and upholding British Empire borders. Once those are settled, there's should be no problems .

Britih india's territory is much smaller compared to the maps of ancient india's original boundary !!
But mate, we are content with what we have, nothing more nor nothing less :)
 
India's Misguided China Anxiety


By Anil K. Gupta and Haiyan Wang on March 21, 2012

India’s growing trade deficit with China—an estimated $27 billion in 2011—has become a source of anguish in Indian policy circles. Bilateral trade between the two emerging giants grew to $73 billion in 2011, up from $63 billion in 2010 and less than $3 billion in 2000. The Indian side, though, is becoming increasingly alarmed over the growing trade balance in China’s favor, which amounted to a Chinese surplus of $23.9 billion last year.

In December, India’s National Security Council Secretariat, the apex agency responsible for economic and strategic security, even circulated a note to various ministries detailing its concerns and backing a possible move by the country’s Department of Commerce to start restricting imports from China. Unfortunately, much of the public discussion on this subject has tended to be shallow. Few people seem to understand the trade deficit’s underlying causes, its implications for India’s economy, and what India should do to create a better balance.

There’s no question that India’s overall merchandise trade deficit is soaring, growing from $13 billion in 2000 to $103 billion in 2010 and an estimated $150 billion in 2011. At more than 6 percent of the GDP, India’s trade gap is huge. The trade deficit has grown even though India over the past 10 years has been the fastest-growing exporter among the world’s top 10 economies. From 2000 to 2010, India’s exports grew at an annual rate of 19.3 percent—more than twice the rate of the 9 percent growth in world trade and about the same as the 20.1 percent average annual growth in China’s exports.

Even if the trade deficit with China were magically to vanish, it would do little to address the country’s trade imbalance. The deficit with China accounts for less than 20 percent of the country’s total trade deficit, with India importing Made-in-China toys, consumer electronics, telecommunications gear, and power equipment. More damaging to India’s trade numbers, though, is the reliance on imported oil, gas, and coal from such places as Saudi Arabia, Iran, Australia, and Indonesia. Energy accounts for more than 65 percent of the trade deficit. In sum, the primary trade challenge for India is rooted in its rapidly growing need for energy coupled with the rapidly increasing price of energy resources.

Let’s now look at the underlying causes of India’s trade deficit with China. Children’s toys may be a highly visible symbol of China’s seeming invasion of India. They account for less than 1 percent, however, of India’s imports from China. Of China’s total 2010 exports of more than $40 billion to India, more than 60 percent came from capital goods, such as electrical machinery, nuclear reactors, boilers, iron and steel products, ships and boats, and project goods.

Starting in 2007, India’s political leaders finally began a serious effort to address the country’s massive infrastructure deficit. This has meant rapid growth in investment in sectors such as power, telecommunications, ports, roads and highways. Since India’s domestic producers have been unable to keep up with the growing need for machinery and other capital goods, the country has no choice but to import equipment. With prices 30 percent or more below those offered by suppliers in the U.S., Europe, or Japan, Chinese companies have been the natural beneficiaries of India’s growing appetite for capital goods. India does have some things that China wants: India is one of the world’s largest producers of iron ore and cotton, and China is a major customer. Not surprisingly, as the world’s largest cotton importer, China has complained about India’s recent moves to ban cotton exports. Given pressure also from India’s cotton farmers, the government has now decided partially to reverse the ban.

With a less competitive manufacturing sector, though, India cannot hope to export large volumes of manufactured goods to China. India is much stronger than China in information technology (IT) and IT-enabled services. Given Indian providers’ fluency in English and not Mandarin, however, there is very limited scope for India to export such services to China.

What would happen if the Indian government were to restrict imports of Chinese capital goods into the country? Yes, the trade deficit with China would come down, but the country’s overall trade deficit would become even bigger. To see why, look at the $8.29 billion order that India’s Reliance Power placed in 2010 with Shanghai Electric to supply equipment that would generate nearly 24 GW of electricity annually. (That’s equal to about a fifth of India’s total electricity production.) The agreement included a financing deal with a consortium of Chinese banks, such as Bank of China and China Development Bank, providing low-cost financing. If Reliance Power had purchased this equipment from non-Chinese suppliers, the price would have been a few billion dollars higher and the company would have faced difficulties figuring out how to pay for the purchase.


It would therefore be self-defeating for India to erect artificial barriers to imports from China. Nonetheless, as part of smarter engagement with China, India can and should pursue a number of policies. First, given unsettled border tensions and a fluid geopolitical environment, India should continue to emphasize national security issues. National security should not, however, become an excuse for artificial trade barriers.

Second, taking a page from China’s own industrial policies, India’s leaders should demand that Chinese companies wishing to remain major suppliers to Indian companies start manufacturing in India. As the size of India’s market for manufactured goods continues to grow, this would also become an increasingly attractive strategy for Chinese companies.

Third, India must demand reciprocity vis-à-vis market access. For example, consider the auto sector. Chinese auto companies are keen to go global and, outside of China, see India as the hottest and fastest-growing market in the world. With that in mind, India’s leaders should ask their Chinese counterparts why India should open its market to Chinese auto companies when China does not permit foreign auto companies interested in coming to China to take more than a 50 percent equity stake.

During the current decade, India’s top economic priority should be to keep pushing infrastructure buildup at a very aggressive pace. Imports of less-expensive capital goods from China, financed by low-cost capital from Chinese banks, help India accomplish this agenda at an accelerated pace. India’s labor costs are already cheaper than China’s. India’s engineering and management skills are also world-class. The sooner the infrastructure deficit gets addressed, the faster India will start to become more competitive than China on the manufacturing front. By exporting low-priced capital goods to India, China is helping to create an economy that will prove to be its toughest competitor by 2020. Maybe sooner.

India's Misguided China Anxiety - Businessweek
 
The total share is decreasing, but the share of heavy industry and other high value added goods is increasing.

China has already demolished the Korean market in electrical transformers in India and now dominates 90% of the market. We've overtaken BHEL with 40% market share in all power generation machinery.

The previous exports of toys and furniture were larger though, so as their share goes down, despite heavy industry gaining, our total exports are lowered.

I think u r right in this...
In chennai where i live some 11 tunnel boring machines (TBMs) were bought from china for our metro rail project and cranes for kattupalli ship port by L&T were also bought from china...
China have become good manufacturers in heavy engineering... We need to learn from them in these kinda manufacturing...
 
India's Misguided China Anxiety


By Anil K. Gupta and Haiyan Wang on March 21, 2012

India’s growing trade deficit with China—an estimated $27 billion in 2011—has become a source of anguish in Indian policy circles. Bilateral trade between the two emerging giants grew to $73 billion in 2011, up from $63 billion in 2010 and less than $3 billion in 2000. The Indian side, though, is becoming increasingly alarmed over the growing trade balance in China’s favor, which amounted to a Chinese surplus of $23.9 billion last year.

In December, India’s National Security Council Secretariat, the apex agency responsible for economic and strategic security, even circulated a note to various ministries detailing its concerns and backing a possible move by the country’s Department of Commerce to start restricting imports from China. Unfortunately, much of the public discussion on this subject has tended to be shallow. Few people seem to understand the trade deficit’s underlying causes, its implications for India’s economy, and what India should do to create a better balance.

There’s no question that India’s overall merchandise trade deficit is soaring, growing from $13 billion in 2000 to $103 billion in 2010 and an estimated $150 billion in 2011. At more than 6 percent of the GDP, India’s trade gap is huge. The trade deficit has grown even though India over the past 10 years has been the fastest-growing exporter among the world’s top 10 economies. From 2000 to 2010, India’s exports grew at an annual rate of 19.3 percent—more than twice the rate of the 9 percent growth in world trade and about the same as the 20.1 percent average annual growth in China’s exports.

Even if the trade deficit with China were magically to vanish, it would do little to address the country’s trade imbalance. The deficit with China accounts for less than 20 percent of the country’s total trade deficit, with India importing Made-in-China toys, consumer electronics, telecommunications gear, and power equipment. More damaging to India’s trade numbers, though, is the reliance on imported oil, gas, and coal from such places as Saudi Arabia, Iran, Australia, and Indonesia. Energy accounts for more than 65 percent of the trade deficit. In sum, the primary trade challenge for India is rooted in its rapidly growing need for energy coupled with the rapidly increasing price of energy resources.

Let’s now look at the underlying causes of India’s trade deficit with China. Children’s toys may be a highly visible symbol of China’s seeming invasion of India. They account for less than 1 percent, however, of India’s imports from China. Of China’s total 2010 exports of more than $40 billion to India, more than 60 percent came from capital goods, such as electrical machinery, nuclear reactors, boilers, iron and steel products, ships and boats, and project goods.

Starting in 2007, India’s political leaders finally began a serious effort to address the country’s massive infrastructure deficit. This has meant rapid growth in investment in sectors such as power, telecommunications, ports, roads and highways. Since India’s domestic producers have been unable to keep up with the growing need for machinery and other capital goods, the country has no choice but to import equipment. With prices 30 percent or more below those offered by suppliers in the U.S., Europe, or Japan, Chinese companies have been the natural beneficiaries of India’s growing appetite for capital goods. India does have some things that China wants: India is one of the world’s largest producers of iron ore and cotton, and China is a major customer. Not surprisingly, as the world’s largest cotton importer, China has complained about India’s recent moves to ban cotton exports. Given pressure also from India’s cotton farmers, the government has now decided partially to reverse the ban.

With a less competitive manufacturing sector, though, India cannot hope to export large volumes of manufactured goods to China. India is much stronger than China in information technology (IT) and IT-enabled services. Given Indian providers’ fluency in English and not Mandarin, however, there is very limited scope for India to export such services to China.

What would happen if the Indian government were to restrict imports of Chinese capital goods into the country? Yes, the trade deficit with China would come down, but the country’s overall trade deficit would become even bigger. To see why, look at the $8.29 billion order that India’s Reliance Power placed in 2010 with Shanghai Electric to supply equipment that would generate nearly 24 GW of electricity annually. (That’s equal to about a fifth of India’s total electricity production.) The agreement included a financing deal with a consortium of Chinese banks, such as Bank of China and China Development Bank, providing low-cost financing. If Reliance Power had purchased this equipment from non-Chinese suppliers, the price would have been a few billion dollars higher and the company would have faced difficulties figuring out how to pay for the purchase.


It would therefore be self-defeating for India to erect artificial barriers to imports from China. Nonetheless, as part of smarter engagement with China, India can and should pursue a number of policies. First, given unsettled border tensions and a fluid geopolitical environment, India should continue to emphasize national security issues. National security should not, however, become an excuse for artificial trade barriers.

Second, taking a page from China’s own industrial policies, India’s leaders should demand that Chinese companies wishing to remain major suppliers to Indian companies start manufacturing in India. As the size of India’s market for manufactured goods continues to grow, this would also become an increasingly attractive strategy for Chinese companies.

Third, India must demand reciprocity vis-à-vis market access. For example, consider the auto sector. Chinese auto companies are keen to go global and, outside of China, see India as the hottest and fastest-growing market in the world. With that in mind, India’s leaders should ask their Chinese counterparts why India should open its market to Chinese auto companies when China does not permit foreign auto companies interested in coming to China to take more than a 50 percent equity stake.

During the current decade, India’s top economic priority should be to keep pushing infrastructure buildup at a very aggressive pace. Imports of less-expensive capital goods from China, financed by low-cost capital from Chinese banks, help India accomplish this agenda at an accelerated pace. India’s labor costs are already cheaper than China’s. India’s engineering and management skills are also world-class. The sooner the infrastructure deficit gets addressed, the faster India will start to become more competitive than China on the manufacturing front. By exporting low-priced capital goods to India, China is helping to create an economy that will prove to be its toughest competitor by 2020. Maybe sooner.

India's Misguided China Anxiety - Businessweek

First we never importt nuclear reactors from china...And we are the ones who are selling Iron to china along with high grade steel products...
The source needs some correction
 
First we never importt nuclear reactors from china...And we are the ones who are selling Iron to china along with high grade steel products...
The source needs some correction


China power equipment manufacturer Dongfang Electric Corporation Ltd(DEC) is a supplier of Electricite De France (EDF).

Dongfang Electric Corporation signed its first export contract with EDF

Electricite De France (EDF) is building two nuclear power plants in India worth $9.3 billion.
AFP: France, India sign nuclear deal on Sarkozy visit

And DEC also export power equipment and wind power equipment to India.
Dongfang Electric wins two contracts in India

By the way , would you please show the resouse where "India export high grade steel products to China"?
 
india's economic crisis (rupee hyperinflation) means it can't afford Chinese manufactures anymore. They must buy local indian handicrafts or take from nature.
What is 'rupee hyperinflation'?
Anyways, Indians buying Indian goods is a good thing for India, isn't it? for whatever reason it may be .....
 
^ you dont need to quote isolated case for argument and worse to quote it from a dubious source for your back up!

You dont have a clue how the international trade between China and your gratefully adopted country usa is running.

China's Trade with the United States, 2001-11 ($ billion)

Notes: *Calculated by USCBC. US exports reported on a free-alongside-ship basis; imports on a general customs-value basis.

Source: US Department of Commerce; US International Trade Commission (ITC)

2001 2002 2003 2004 2005 2006 2007 2008 2009 2010 2011

US exports 19.2 22.1 28.4 34.7 41.8 55.2 65.2 71.5 69.6 91.9 103.9
% change* 18.3 14.7 28.9 22.2 20.5 32.0 18.1 9.5 -2.6 32.1 13.1

US imports 102.3 125.2 152.4 196.7 243.5 287.8 321.5 337.8 296.4 364.9 399.3
% change* 2.2 22.4 21.7 29.1 23.8 18.2 11.7 5.1 -12.3 23.1 9.4

How do you explain the bold figures and then other figures in the table?
 
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