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China Clones the Tor M1

Ahassan

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February 15, 2008: China has apparently cloned another Russian weapon, in this case the Tor-M1 air defense system. The Chinese version is called HQ17. China has earlier bought 30 Tor M1 systems.
The Tor-M1 is known to NATO as the SA-15 Gauntlet. It has a maximum range of 12 kilometers. It is only effective up to 6,000 meters altitude. The system was designed as a successor to the SA-N-8 Gecko. Each launcher carries eight missiles, and it is claimed to be capable of engaging two targets simultaneously. The system was designed to be a tactical battlefield air-defense system, designed to take out close-air-support planes like the A-10 or tactical fighter-bombers like the F-4, F-16, and F-18.
It is thought that China wants such a low altitude system for defense against new Taiwanese cruise missiles. However, cruise missile, which go as fast as 880 kilometers per hour, and comes in at very low altitudes, would be hard for the Tor-M1 to hit. A single Tor would have 49 seconds at most to engage a cruise missile if it detects the missile at its maximum range. That is a pretty big if, as radar performance declines against low-altitude targets. This assumes the missile will hit. If the missile misses (not an unthinkable occurrence in some circumstances), then more have to be fired.
There are vulnerabilities as well. Most Taiwanese combat planes can easily fly at altitudes above 6000 meters. These aircraft would have the option of either attacking the Tor systems themselves (and clearing the road for cruise missiles or combat aircraft to attack the main target), or going for the main target itself.
Tor could also be neutralized by sending in UAVs or target drones on a flight profile similar to that flown by combat aircraft or cruise missiles. This was the technique used in the 1991 Gulf War against the Iraqi air defense system. The Iraqis fired at the drones, revealing the location of the missile batteries and drawing very prompt attention from American Wild Weasels. The Iraqi system was neutralized very quickly.:china:

Air Defense: China Clones the Tor M1
 
February 15, 2008: China has apparently cloned another Russian weapon, in this case the Tor-M1 air defense system. The Chinese version is called HQ17. China has earlier bought 30 Tor M1 systems.
The Tor-M1 is known to NATO as the SA-15 Gauntlet. It has a maximum range of 12 kilometers. It is only effective up to 6,000 meters altitude. The system was designed as a successor to the SA-N-8 Gecko. Each launcher carries eight missiles, and it is claimed to be capable of engaging two targets simultaneously. The system was designed to be a tactical battlefield air-defense system, designed to take out close-air-support planes like the A-10 or tactical fighter-bombers like the F-4, F-16, and F-18.
It is thought that China wants such a low altitude system for defense against new Taiwanese cruise missiles. However, cruise missile, which go as fast as 880 kilometers per hour, and comes in at very low altitudes, would be hard for the Tor-M1 to hit. A single Tor would have 49 seconds at most to engage a cruise missile if it detects the missile at its maximum range. That is a pretty big if, as radar performance declines against low-altitude targets. This assumes the missile will hit. If the missile misses (not an unthinkable occurrence in some circumstances), then more have to be fired.
There are vulnerabilities as well. Most Taiwanese combat planes can easily fly at altitudes above 6000 meters. These aircraft would have the option of either attacking the Tor systems themselves (and clearing the road for cruise missiles or combat aircraft to attack the main target), or going for the main target itself.
Tor could also be neutralized by sending in UAVs or target drones on a flight profile similar to that flown by combat aircraft or cruise missiles. This was the technique used in the 1991 Gulf War against the Iraqi air defense system. The Iraqis fired at the drones, revealing the location of the missile batteries and drawing very prompt attention from American Wild Weasels. The Iraqi system was neutralized very quickly.:china:

Air Defense: China Clones the Tor M1
Chinese should make something really effective and not clone Old Russian weapons which have become outdated.
 
India does not operate the Tor-M1. They are buying the Spyder..
 
Firstly you haven't the slightest clue of what you are talking about. Secondly India operates this system. You just slapped your country in the face by attempting to discredit the Chinese. Was it worth it? The Chinese variant will be similar to Tor-M2 in performance.
Mr Beast, I am Patriotic, but that doesnt mean I am stupid! If my country operates an obsolete system, then I will call it out! I dont think India is operating the TOR, if they are, then fine.

India is upgrading the air defenses with Israeli equipments and indigenous stuff. We do operate the S300 and will be getting hold of the 400 as soon as the russians are completely ready with it! China should get over remaking Russian stuff and make something of its own, especially since Its so economically strong and all, they can afford it.
 
Firstly you haven't the slightest clue of what you are talking about. Secondly India operates this system. You just slapped your country in the face by attempting to discredit the Chinese. Was it worth it? The Chinese variant will be similar to Tor-M2 in performance.
one more thing, please dont be prejudiced. You really dont know me, so u dont know what I know and what I dont know! Always remember that before you indulge in conversations on the Net!
 
Tor could also be neutralized by sending in UAVs or target drones on a flight profile similar to that flown by combat aircraft or cruise missiles. This was the technique used in the 1991 Gulf War against the Iraqi air defense system. The Iraqis fired at the drones, revealing the location of the missile batteries and drawing very prompt attention from American Wild Weasels. The Iraqi system was neutralized very quickly.
Well, you can't say that we Yanks aren't clever. We may not be able to defeat a bunch of tribals on qaat but we like to play for keeps with our toys.
 
It still remains effective against the A-10. The arguments you've raised against cruise missiles vs HQ17 is pretty much the same for cruise missile vs every air defence system.

We can't assume this poorly written "article" is correct and if the HQ17 is even a clone of the Tor-M1.
 
It still remains effective against the A-10. The arguments you've raised against cruise missiles vs HQ17 is pretty much the same for cruise missile vs every air defence system.

We can't assume this poorly written "article" is correct and if the HQ17 is even a clone of the Tor-M1.
Yes, it will effective against A-10s for sure, but the US operates the A-10s only after every kind of air defence has been eliminated and there is total Air cover. Well China has to work hard to counter the cruise missiles and other weapons which the US can use in case of hostilities.
 
one more thing, please dont be prejudiced. You really dont know me, so u dont know what I know and what I dont know! Always remember that before you indulge in conversations on the Net!

Well dear Mr. Indiann..this is the problem with all Indians..first they claim and then they blame and then they come up with stupid justifications. keep living in your wet dreams that I know better than you.:pakistan::china:
 
It is a double edged sword for the Russians, they cannot turn down the Chinese market and at the same time when they sell things...the Chinese would clone it or bring out an improved version.

Such irony for the Russians.
 
Tor could also be neutralized by sending in UAVs or target drones on a flight profile similar to that flown by combat aircraft or cruise missiles. This was the technique used in the 1991 Gulf War against the Iraqi air defense system. The Iraqis fired at the drones, revealing the location of the missile batteries and drawing very prompt attention from American Wild Weasels. The Iraqi system was neutralized very quickly.
Well, you can't say that we Yanks aren't clever. We may not be able to defeat a bunch of tribals on qaat but we like to play for keeps with our toys.

Truthseeker the basic technology of such equipment remains the same it is just the upgradation which helps it achieve the work of this decade.

Look at the F-16 .. a project convieved in the mid 60;s but with correct upgrades it is a formidable plane. Now if you compare the same plane against a F-22 or Eurofighter than yes a kill can be achieved, otherwise in many instances it is a formidable opponent.

The same goes for the HQ17. If linked with good battery of radars & with it's modifications (extra cieling) it is a excellent airdefense battery for many countries who cannot acqurie US equipment + cheap solution.
 
well i hope the chinese know their stuff. I know the quality fo chinese toys. Hope their military hardware is trustworthy.

u r equating chinese toys to chinese military hardware:rofl:
 
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