Babur praised South-Asian caste system as an advantage

[Naofumi]

Ambedkar had unreal expectations.

He stood for absolute equality, I won't call it unreal expectations.

 

[Pan-Islamic-Pakistan]

Umm, to me he can be easily identified as an Indian but nevermind.

Facial structure, nose shape, hair growth, etc. Is totally different.

He is Pakistani, through and through. Similar to the looks of many Rajput Punjabis, of which I am one as well.

Maududi was an opportunist. He opposed Pakistan right uptil Partition and when he realized ke ab India mein uski daal nahi galni he jumped ship.

I will explain to you at a later date brother, but please do not deride one of the greatest blessings to Pakistan we have had.

Pakistan is here because of his mindset, he had a deep and strong influence on our thinking. Esp after 1971, we had to rationalize Pakistan's identity, then his idea of Islam vs Jahalat, light vs dark, full commitment to Islam vs partial commitment to Islam gained new meaning.

I may make a thread on this later, since many Pakistanis have this misconception.

 

[Pakistani E]

He stood for absolute equality, I won't call it unreal expectations.

I would. I do not believe true equality is possible in a human society. There are always people more equal than others. Human "culture" is pretty much based on some sort of hierarchy. There are certain things that can never be completely eradicated for there to be true equality. I.e. wealth, physical forms, etc.

What we should be aiming for is justice. Justice ensures we treat people justly and take in to consideration human nature, context and tolerance of other beliefs/views.

P.S. Sorry, I won't be able to reply to this reply, I've reached my daily set limit of 3 posts.

 

[Pan-Islamic-Pakistan]

He stood for absolute equality, I won't call it unreal expectations.

He compared Islam to Hinduism and extrapolated their customs on us. That is his folly. Plus his motivations were secular and not religious.

Islamic lifestyle is very different to what he wanted.

 

[Naofumi]

There are certain things that can never be completely eradicated for there to be true equality. I.e. wealth, physical forms, etc.

But lineage and caste? Lineage based rights are antithetical to justice itself.
I mean why we can't make it a meritocracy whether it's physical forms, intelligence etc? In a meritocracy, inequality exists but it's earned inequality not because of accident of birth.

He compared Islam to Hinduism and extrapolated their customs on us. That is his folly. Plus his motivations were secular and not religious.

Islamic lifestyle is very different to what he wanted.

How could he accept a new people where he will be treated as same or worse? Will any sane human do?

Leave our South-Asian caste-system, see this

The ruling relevant to non-Arabs is as follows: ‘An Ajmi (non-Arab) cannot be a match for a woman of Arab descent, no matter that he be an Aalim (religious scholar) or even a Sultan (ruling authority). (Raddul Muhtar p.209 v.4)

https://islamqa.org/hanafi/daruliftaa-birmingham/87680

 

[Arulmozhi Varman]

Edit : You were saying about general population? Nope, see the map below. We ain't same bro though there's nothing wrong in that.

1) What part of "in some regions", you don't understand?
2) Yup, That's the difference between Pancha Gaud and Pancha Dravida.


Haplogroup R1a

I was talking of the paper done in Rakhigarhi dna studies. For obvious reasons it actually proved some sort of in-migration did take place but the scale is overblown.
ASI has some Iranian Pastoralist gene, while the ANI had some Central Asian gene before both the asi and ani intermixed to current people today. But the female gene transfer of both the asi and ani is the same with only the male component showing new ones, telling us, that some sort of same native people lived in this land, north and south alike.

 

[Naofumi]

I was talking of the paper done in Rakhigarhi dna studies. For obvious reasons it actually proved some sort of in-migration did take place but the scale is overblown.
ASI has some Iranian Pastoralist gene, while the ANI had some Central Asian gene before both the asi and ani intermixed to current people today. But the female gene transfer of both the asi and ani is the same with only the male component showing new ones, telling us, that some sort of same native people lived in this land, north and south alike.

Are you saying Rakhigarhi DNA findings -> No Aryan migration (as believed traditionally)?
https://theprint.in/opinion/newsmak...-week-and-made-indians-ask-who-are-we/288151/

 

[Arulmozhi Varman]

Are you saying Rakhigarhi DNA findings -> No Aryan migration (as believed in academia)?
https://theprint.in/opinion/newsmak...-week-and-made-indians-ask-who-are-we/288151/

It had aryan. Though it was a myth why the research head said no "foreign," dna had come in his media briefing while his report said something else.

 

[Nilgiri]

So, I think you're broadly right.

Well I studied Japanese and Chinese history somewhat extensively. I am just giving you a very limited synopsis here. You have to read lot of primary sources (East Asians have kept good records above average on it) to get a better sustenance for it.

Haha, I like history generally but you're correct I am fascinated (primarily because of anime).. My username is Japanese too.

I keep coming across you lot more and more. This thing was barely known in India in the 90s when I would reference things like Dragonball Z (and get bemused confused stares from everyone) when I was visiting family... now its a whole subculture in India too.

Akira Kurosawa movies also played their role in being one of the major early portals I had to my interest in Japanese history and Japan in general. Along with a childhood Japanese friend whom I have known since kindergarten days.... in fact she still teases me about all that nonsense we got up to.

@Vapnope btw ole chum, I wasn't in mood when you queried me earlier about Maratha hypothetical history...but this thread esp my reply in #92 should give you a little context on it now if you are interested.

 

[Naofumi]

Well I studied Japanese and Chinese history somewhat extensively. I am just giving you a very limited synopsis here. You have to read lot of primary sources (East Asians have kept good records above average on it) to get a better sustenance for it.

Had skimmed over Wikipedia pages (around 100s of them) and google two-three years, have read it in detail from the legendary Xia dynasty to modern PRC though details are all blurred now.. Never touched any primary source though.

I keep coming across you lot more and more. This thing was barely known in India in the 90s when I would reference things like Dragonball Z (and get bemused confused stares from everyone) when I was visiting family... now its a whole subculture in India too.

Akira Kurosawa movies also played their role in being one of the major early portals I had to my interest in Japanese history and Japan in general. Along with a childhood Japanese friend whom I have known since kindergarten days.... in fact she still teases me about all that nonsense we got up to.

Today, it have got varied and limited at the same time; there are some masterpieces though like Berserk (1997), Kaiji : The Gambler, Monster, Steins;Gate and The Promised Neverland. It definitely have got more popular now.

 

[Nilgiri]

Had skimmed over Wikipedia pages (around 100s of them) and google two-three years, have read it in detail from the legendary Xia dynasty to modern PRC though details are all blurred now.. Never touched any primary source though.

Its a good start...wiki often will have good sources listed that merit further investigation...this is often avenue to get to the primary and secondary sources (by that I mean translation of those)...as your interest dictates it.

 

[Kamikaze Pilot]

We don't appreciate smart talkers. We let them be a little humbled down before coming to their rescue.

Multiple id rat is back.

@I S I @El Sidd

- PRTP GWD

 

[Nein]

Interested in Baburs use of Ottoman volunteers and advisors.

Most likely a lot of them stayed and became part of the future of the Mughal Empire.

Babur is an underrated Conqueror.

 

[Yankee-stani]

I would. I do not believe true equality is possible in a human society. There are always people more equal than others. Human "culture" is pretty much based on some sort of hierarchy. There are certain things that can never be completely eradicated for there to be true equality. I.e. wealth, physical forms, etc.

What we should be aiming for is justice. Justice ensures we treat people justly and take in to consideration human nature, context and tolerance of other beliefs/views.

P.S. Sorry, I won't be able to reply to this reply, I've reached my daily set limit of 3 posts.

Which is why I find many leftists particularly the Marxists Leninist types cringe on class warfare instead the social classes should work to lessen gaps between each other and work for the common interests of the nation and its people