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As Iraq's Kurds eye statehood, a border takes shape

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MAKHMUR, Iraq – The sand berms and trenches that snake across northern Iraq stretch toward Syria, some accompanied by newly paved roads lit by street lamps and sprawling checkpoints decked with Kurdish flags. The fighters here insist it isn't the border of a newly independent state — but in the chaos of Iraq that could change.

Construction began in 2014, when this marked the front line between U.S.-backed Kurdish forces, known as the peshmerga, and the Islamic State group, which had swept across northern Iraq that summer, routing the army and threatening the Kurdish autonomous region.

Since then, a more permanent boundary has taken shape as Kurdish aspirations for outright independence have grown. The frontier could mark the fault-line of a new conflict in Iraq once the extremists are defeated. A similar process is underway in Syria, where Syrian Kurdish forces have seized large swathes of land from IS.

"It was our front line, now it's our border, and we will stay forever," said peshmerga commander and business magnate Sirwan Barzani. He's among a growing number of Kurdish leaders, including his uncle, the Kurdish region's President Massoud Barzani, who say that lands taken from IS will remain in Kurdish hands.

The Kurds have been at loggerheads with the Baghdad government over the so-called disputed territories — lands stretching across northern and eastern Iraq — since the 2003 U.S.-led invasion. Article 140 of the Iraqi constitution says their fate should be decided by a referendum, but such a vote has yet to be held, and as the Iraqi army collapsed in 2014, the Kurds moved in.

They took control of the long-disputed northern city of Kirkuk that summer, ostensibly to protect it from IS. Since then, with the aid of U.S.-led airstrikes, the Kurds have taken territory equivalent to 50 percent of their recognized autonomous region.

"After the defeat of IS, Sunnis will dispute the Kurdish claims, the Shiites in Baghdad will dispute both the Sunni claims and the Kurdish claims, and the possibility of conflict there is real," said Anwar Anaid, dean of social sciences at the University of Kurdistan Hewler. "What happens on the ground depends on the circumstances. There is a real Kurdish wish to go for independence."

Peshmerga commander Aref Taymour said that once IS is driven from the northern city of Mosul, the Kurds will negotiate a new border with Baghdad. But he added that "lands that have been liberated by blood, we have no intention to give them back to the federal government."

Another Kurdish official, Dishad Mawlod, was even more direct, describing the fortifications as the "future borders of Kurdistan."

"We're not violating any international laws, nor are we occupying anyone's land," he said.

Barzani, the regional president's nephew, said the Kurds no longer trust the Iraqi army to defend the country, after it lost nearly a third of it to IS two and a half years ago.

"Of course there will be another Daesh," he said, referring to IS by its Arabic acronym. "None of the internal Iraqi issues have been resolved," he added, saying the Kurds "will be ready." In the meantime, he hopes for talks on independence as early as next year.

"It's a bad marriage, let's get a divorce," he said.

The Baghdad government is staunchly opposed to Kurdish independence, and Prime Minister Haider al-Abadi says he expects the Kurds to abide by an agreement that they withdraw from areas captured since the start of the Mosul operation in October.

"Some Kurdish politicians are saying otherwise. But they are not responsible people and they are not controlling events on the ground," al-Abadi said in an interview with The Associated Press last week.

The two sides have set the dispute aside as they work together to drive IS from Mosul, Iraq's second largest city, but the construction along the frontier is continuing. On one road south of Mosul, peshmerga fighters were building cinderblock stairways leading to offices in trailers, as guard posts were being set up further along the line.

Aware of the sensitivities, Iraqi soldiers and Kurdish fighters stationed along the frontier are reluctant to speak about the matter.

"You can't take pictures, and whatever you do, don't call this a border!" a peshmerga fighter said as he came sauntering out of a checkpoint complex along the frontier. He refused to give his name.

At a nearby army position, Iraqi soldier Hussein Jassem acknowledged that "there is a border between us and the peshmerga." He declined to comment further.

Foxnews

"lands that have been liberated by blood, we have no intention to give them back to the federal government."

Are we gonna see the Kurdexit from Iraq after Daesh leaves Mosul?
 
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iraq%20kurds%20banner.jpg

MAKHMUR, Iraq – The sand berms and trenches that snake across northern Iraq stretch toward Syria, some accompanied by newly paved roads lit by street lamps and sprawling checkpoints decked with Kurdish flags. The fighters here insist it isn't the border of a newly independent state — but in the chaos of Iraq that could change.

Construction began in 2014, when this marked the front line between U.S.-backed Kurdish forces, known as the peshmerga, and the Islamic State group, which had swept across northern Iraq that summer, routing the army and threatening the Kurdish autonomous region.

Since then, a more permanent boundary has taken shape as Kurdish aspirations for outright independence have grown. The frontier could mark the fault-line of a new conflict in Iraq once the extremists are defeated. A similar process is underway in Syria, where Syrian Kurdish forces have seized large swathes of land from IS.

"It was our front line, now it's our border, and we will stay forever," said peshmerga commander and business magnate Sirwan Barzani. He's among a growing number of Kurdish leaders, including his uncle, the Kurdish region's President Massoud Barzani, who say that lands taken from IS will remain in Kurdish hands.

The Kurds have been at loggerheads with the Baghdad government over the so-called disputed territories — lands stretching across northern and eastern Iraq — since the 2003 U.S.-led invasion. Article 140 of the Iraqi constitution says their fate should be decided by a referendum, but such a vote has yet to be held, and as the Iraqi army collapsed in 2014, the Kurds moved in.

They took control of the long-disputed northern city of Kirkuk that summer, ostensibly to protect it from IS. Since then, with the aid of U.S.-led airstrikes, the Kurds have taken territory equivalent to 50 percent of their recognized autonomous region.

"After the defeat of IS, Sunnis will dispute the Kurdish claims, the Shiites in Baghdad will dispute both the Sunni claims and the Kurdish claims, and the possibility of conflict there is real," said Anwar Anaid, dean of social sciences at the University of Kurdistan Hewler. "What happens on the ground depends on the circumstances. There is a real Kurdish wish to go for independence."

Peshmerga commander Aref Taymour said that once IS is driven from the northern city of Mosul, the Kurds will negotiate a new border with Baghdad. But he added that "lands that have been liberated by blood, we have no intention to give them back to the federal government."

Another Kurdish official, Dishad Mawlod, was even more direct, describing the fortifications as the "future borders of Kurdistan."

"We're not violating any international laws, nor are we occupying anyone's land," he said.

Barzani, the regional president's nephew, said the Kurds no longer trust the Iraqi army to defend the country, after it lost nearly a third of it to IS two and a half years ago.

"Of course there will be another Daesh," he said, referring to IS by its Arabic acronym. "None of the internal Iraqi issues have been resolved," he added, saying the Kurds "will be ready." In the meantime, he hopes for talks on independence as early as next year.

"It's a bad marriage, let's get a divorce," he said.

The Baghdad government is staunchly opposed to Kurdish independence, and Prime Minister Haider al-Abadi says he expects the Kurds to abide by an agreement that they withdraw from areas captured since the start of the Mosul operation in October.

"Some Kurdish politicians are saying otherwise. But they are not responsible people and they are not controlling events on the ground," al-Abadi said in an interview with The Associated Press last week.

The two sides have set the dispute aside as they work together to drive IS from Mosul, Iraq's second largest city, but the construction along the frontier is continuing. On one road south of Mosul, peshmerga fighters were building cinderblock stairways leading to offices in trailers, as guard posts were being set up further along the line.

Aware of the sensitivities, Iraqi soldiers and Kurdish fighters stationed along the frontier are reluctant to speak about the matter.

"You can't take pictures, and whatever you do, don't call this a border!" a peshmerga fighter said as he came sauntering out of a checkpoint complex along the frontier. He refused to give his name.

At a nearby army position, Iraqi soldier Hussein Jassem acknowledged that "there is a border between us and the peshmerga." He declined to comment further.

Foxnews

"lands that have been liberated by blood, we have no intention to give them back to the federal government."

Are we gonna see the Kurdexit from Iraq after Daesh leaves Mosul?

Well, the current useless illegitimate regime that is composed of many, many traitors that fought against Iraq and Iraqis alongside the cancerous Wilayat al-Faqih Mullah's, which have failed to ensure security in Iraq, who have used fake bomb detectors for almost a decade costing the lives of thousands of civilians, which is extremely corrupt, which has lost TERRITORY to Kurds etc., we cannot expect much from this useless bunch. That ISIS even took over half of Iraq is a GIGANTIC scandal. One of the biggest in history given the billions upon billions that the international society (US mostly) gave to the Iraqi army free of charge. Or the many hours used on training.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/worl...67f334-1868-11e6-971a-dadf9ab18869_story.html

Only ISOF is a capable force more or less.

Anyway this useless traitorous government is doing nothing to help their brethren because their crime happens to be that they are Iraqi Sunni Arabs! So they sit back while Kurds steal land repeatedly. This has also taken place in areas with no or very little ISIS presence. So that excuse cannot be used. Which is a silly excuse as this ISIS should not even have been what it is today if things were done correctly by those incompetent Dawa Islamists and traitors.

May I also add that they have destroyed the Iraqi economy and they are forcing many wise people to migrate abroad due to their continuous stupidity. They also put people in power that are not competent.

Iraq is under occupation of those incompetent clowns and the Wilayat al-Faqih Mullah's that they worship and are ruled by. This and ISIS.

It's time for the Arab world and international community to free Iraq and restore law and order once again. Let patriots rule Iraq. We should never rest before this happens as instability in Iraq means instability in KSA/GCC and Sham which again means instability for Arabs. There is only 2 winners when that happens. Iran and Israel. Two old lovers.

Anyway if Kurds keep making up trouble they will regret it like they regretted bullying Arabs. It always ended very badly for them. Also many Arab refugees have been flooding Kurdistan so I believe that they should not leave an inch and multiply as long as the Kurds are occupying Arab territory in Syria and Iraq illegally. Tarzani should understand this once and for all.
 
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Can u please post a map of Kurdistan .. thanks.

Depends on which "Kurdistan" you are talking about. The light green in the below map is the autonomous Kurdistan region within Iraq (for now). The red dotted line covers the areas Kurdish forces have taken over from ISIS, that fall outside their regions borders.

krgmap.gif


Some Kurdish groups of course dream of a "Greater Kurdistan" composed of these territories.

syriakurd586d.jpg
 
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This is the best opportunity for the khurds to establish their long awaited state.
I say grab it with both hands:yahoo:
 
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Anyone that knows Iraq's politics would ignore this news and save himself the effort, barzani uses this independence nonsense as a card every year for over a decade now, meanwhile they're stuck to Iraq which we all aren't happy about.
 
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What do majority Kurds want? Stay with Iraq or independence?
 
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Can u please post a map of Kurdistan .. thanks.

Here is a map of Kurdistan with the green line dividing the two governments, though Kirkuk isn't included in Kurdistan side, it's still ruled by Kurds and Iraqi government can't even get inside the city without the permission of the Kurds.

_76876578_iraq_kurdistan_624.gif
 
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Anyone that knows Iraq's politics would ignore this news and save himself the effort, barzani uses this independence nonsense as a card every year for over a decade now, meanwhile they're stuck to Iraq which we all aren't happy about.

The current Iraqi government (incompetent by all accounts) has failed to ensure their own NATIONAL BORDERS and to help their own BRETHREN against Kurdish state crimes and the forceful displacement of LOCAL Iraqi Sunni Arabs and the destruction of Arab villages.

Why in the good world has this incompetent regime not been much more vocal against this? It took place BEFORE ISIS as well. It happens in areas where ISIS is no longer present while we speak.

It's something that is inexplicable to me. I cannot understand it. I refuse to understand it.

Yes, and guess whose Tarzanis friends are among others? The Mullah's and Israel. Two old lovers that are currently divorced. On paper that is. Soon to reconcile again.

I cannot phantom how you can support this regime and their ENORMOUS incompetence. Fighting ISIS and defeating them (a question of time) should indeed be the priority but it is like they ignore everything else that is much more important on the long run such as economy, key affairs of the state, the SOVEREIGNTY of Iraq etc.

That's what you get when your government is run by Shia Islamist that are closely allied to the Wilayat al-Faqih Mullah's. Incompetency and more of it.

Here is a map of Kurdistan with the green line dividing the two governments, though Kirkuk isn't included in Kurdistan side, it's still ruled by Kurds and Iraqi government can't even get inside the city without the permission of the Kurds.

_76876578_iraq_kurdistan_624.gif

This is the state of our beloved Iraq. One failure after another since 2003. If the Iraqi regime fails to ensure its nations borders and fails to protectsits people, I believe that Iraqi Sunni Arabs are obligated to create their own autonomous region at least. This cannot go on. The people that are suffering are our very close brethren and many of us still have family relations and keep in touch. Unacceptable.


STOP KURDISH CRIMES IN IRAQ AGAINST PEACEFUL CIVILIANS. WHERE IS AL-ABADI? DOES HE NOT CARE ABOUT HIS COUNTRY OR PEOPLE?
 
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Depends on which "Kurdistan" you are talking about. The light green in the below map is the autonomous Kurdistan region within Iraq (for now). The red dotted line covers the areas Kurdish forces have taken over from ISIS, that fall outside their regions borders.

krgmap.gif


Some Kurdish groups of course dream of a "Greater Kurdistan" composed of these territories.

syriakurd586d.jpg
Huge area in their control certainly they will go for it as it looks like unless uncle Sam stop supporting the unity... turkey and Iran won't let that happen so they will grab anything from Iraq and Syria.
 
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billions upon billions that the international society (US mostly) gave to the Iraqi army free of charge. Or the many hours used on training.
Would you please kindly name few weapons that th the US gave to the Iraqis for free beside some maybe hummers?.
 
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Turkey respects Iraq's soveregnity and said that He won't let a Kurdistan state to be established on borders. We have good ties with KRG, economically our companies sell every need of them. We are the only chance they have for selling their oil to international markets so they are under control. You can see this from Barzani's pro-Turkey speeches. Without Turkish approval they can't be an independence state.
 
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Would you please kindly name few weapons that th the US gave to the Iraqis for free beside some maybe hummers?.

Yes, I have bro.

Military aid to Iraq since 2003:

"The State Department recently released a key fact sheet highlighting the United States’ current attempt to rebuild Iraq’s security forces to combat the rise of the Islamic State (IS). During the Iraq War (2003-2011), the United States spent $23 billion in military and police aid to the country – an average of $2.5 billion per year – on military equipment and training to defeat the insurgency and build an effective fighting force.

Following the collapse of Iraq’s fighting force, the United States is again trying to train and equip the Iraqi military to effectively defeat a terrorist group. In FY2015, Congress allocated $1.6 billion for the Iraq Train and Equip Fund (ITEF) with $1.2 billion for official Iraqi forces, $350 million for Kurdish forces, and $24 million for tribal security forces."


Rest of the article:

http://securityassistance.org/blog/us-factsheet-details-new-spike-us-military-aid-iraq

I would remove/vote out such an incompetent regime. They are destroying Iraq and the lives of Iraqis. Unacceptable.

Anyway I was very disappointed when I saw that you supported crimes committed against fellow Iraqis (Iraqi Sunni Arabs) by terrorist groups and you said that they should not receive help. If an Iraqi based in the US for long time can have such views then how do you think the average Iraqi Shia Arab thinks? Iraq is badly in need of patriotic leaders otherwise I am afraid that Iraq will be divided even more and stop to exist as we know it. This will lead to even more instability in the region which is again unacceptable.

Understand that a stable Iraq is in the interest of every Arab and even every regional state actually.

This is not behavior characteristic of Banu Tayy. Also this has nothing to do with sect before you start discussing this.
 
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