27th February Was Only Half the Surprise Revealed !!!

[Haris Ali2140]

And what's the red line for your restraint?
When the GHQ is threatened?

Because the last time I checked.
It was fine for Americans to come in an bomb your Army post in Salala and murder the troops there.
It was fine to come play the Osama Drama.
It was also fine for Indians to come inside and try to bomb a structure and yet go back unhindered.
And it was completely fine for them to go and rape and kill Kashmiris who are apparently your "shehrug" something?

Anyone even remember Kashmiris anymore after the initial drum beating?

You know what Pakistan is? Its a small, third world, under developed, illiterate country. A country which somehow has gotten nukes and is now a nuisance for countries like USA. Its has no strategic resources that can grant it a special place in the grand schemes. On top of that two of its borders are with countries who haven't accepted it yet. Its population think that its a god given country that has the capacity to combat american, indians and everyone else at the same time.

You should be happy that US didn't bombed you into stone age after what you did to them in Afghanistan.

The kashmiris you are crying about are the same you pointed us out in 65 and then in kargil.

This world is a chess board. A wrong move and you are out of the game.

 

[Pakistani Fighter]

Its has no strategic resources that can grant it a special place in the grand schemes.

Debatable

You should be happy that US didn't bombed you into stone age after what you did to them in Afghanistan.

Its not that easy to get bombed. There are implications. We had nukes thats the problem. An unstablized Pakistan is not good for the World. It would create security problems for the India which was coming as a straregic partner of US. International Jihad would had been the problem. US would had been stuck in Pakistan. China would had lost an important stable straregic ally. The Whole region would probably go Unstable. Thats the reason US doesn't want to create problems with Iran

 

[TheTallGuy]

@The Eagle
Lot of frustration is due to lack information or disinformation shared on and about 27th Feb-19. please do not think any body with different opinion is less patriotic then the ones agreeing the official narrative.

No body here is belittle PAF achievement on 27th Feb-19. i am as proud as you are or @MastanKhan @crankthatskunk they are proud as well. difference on opinion is natural and should be cultivated and appreciated.

Again whole discussion started upon the title of the Thread which tells us that "what we have heard and seen is Only half of it" and he has shared pictures of pilots with call signs and Spartans..agree it confidential but does it pertains to the title of the thread.

So lets find and discuss what was the half that was not revealed..that opens the door for speculation.

so i start with what i have gathered which is not revealed yet some may be true or some mere speculation.

1. HUD cam footage of downing IAF MiG-21
2. HUD cam footage of BVR shot taken at Su-30MKI
3. how many AIM120C5 were fired 2 acknowledged ....speculated 5-6
3. Number of aircraft shot down still 2 claimed, 1 acknowledged speculated to be more or 1 only.
4. 2nd Pilot issue (1st acknowledged and then speculated then hush hushed)
5. Targets claimed to be attacked..6 initially then 4 x acknowledged
6. 26/2/19 at night when "Operation Monkey" was in progress there was only single F-16 that tried intercepting the IAF strike package.
7. composition of IAF on 27-2-19
8. how many IAF fighters after operation were in combat area.

these kind of info would be revealing...if i am correct.

 

[The Eagle]

Lot of frustration is due to lack information or disinformation shared on and about 27th Feb-19. please do not think any body with different opinion is less patriotic then the ones agreeing the official narrative.

If you read my post again, I didn't say anyone is less patriot at all. I will request you not to divert from good intent of my post please. Secondly, lack of information or disinformation is beneficial and keeps the enemy confused.

No body here is belittle PAF achievement on 27th Feb-19. i am as proud as you are or @MastanKhan @crankthatskunk they are proud as well. difference on opinion is natural and should be cultivated and appreciated.

Did I blame anyone for not being patriot? In-fact my discussion with respective member was based upon heat of debate on thread & my observations while I read different posts. You totally missed the core part of my posts.

Regards,

 

[Pakistani Fighter]

26/2/19 at night when "Operation Monkey" was in progress there was only single F-16 that tried intercepting the IAF strike package.

According to @airomerix JF 17s had locked Indian Mirages

 

[Windjammer]

Basics!!
Yeah true very true. That's why you try to start every thread with "inside" information.
Says it all.

Well, it's been a year and i would have loved to see you or someone else posting something more than mere images of a battered Abhinandan being taken into custody or shown slurping some tea.

I on the other hand only analyse, without claiming anything. I know plain thinking and honesty is not normal for most Pakistanis.

It's also in nature of some to digress other than digest, the difference is I'm claiming with substance without waving my hands in the air, at one time I belonged to a family of soldiers but looking around now, I can't recall a single person serving in the armed forces hence I don't make high claims '

Thank you. I will say only this. I come from a family background, which can take me to places, if I want to go there. But because it is not my interest or liking

Did you ever failed to understand Pakistan's standing in the world!!! Why they are treated so badly on airports all around the world!!

Damn, that must be due to certain threads and discussions happening here on PDF, after all, everyone sitting behind a desk at say Heathrow has a computer in front of them, how difficult would it be for them to log in on PDF and judge us Pakistanis....or maybe they see how anytime a corrupt Pakistani politician or some Thekeedar of Islam lands at a Western airport, we Pakistanis throng there by coachloads to welcome our saviours.

When I look all around me, I see garbage, loose talk grand standing etc. Most Pakistanis I see in the shops, restaurants and other places all lives in DHA's, Clifton of Pakistan, but strangely either working in a restaurant, takeaways or driving CABS. Most people I know personally and through family do live in the DHA's and Clifton. They don't come to the UK/USA/EUROPE to work in the takeaways, restaurants and drive cabs. They come for luxurious holidays and shopping.
You feel throwing up when you finish discussion with them.
I don't go there. It is a personal decision. The only thing I hate are people who try to grandstand. That is the only reason for me objecting to some people's point of view.

When one considers others as garbage around him, I wonder who fancies himself as above others, a unique, privileged grandeur character whose head is in the clouds...well my friend this common folks forum is no place for any high flyers....so stop wasting yourself and let others continue...after all the site has continued to run for over a decade without appointment by HM the Queen.

 

[crankthatskunk]

And what's the red line for your restraint?
When the GHQ is threatened?

Because the last time I checked.
It was fine for Americans to come in an bomb your Army post in Salala and murder the troops there.
It was fine to come play the Osama Drama.
It was also fine for Indians to come inside and try to bomb a structure and yet go back unhindered.
And it was completely fine for them to go and rape and kill Kashmiris who are apparently your "shehrug" something?

Anyone even remember Kashmiris anymore after the initial drum beating?

Spot on. But I am convinced there would be many who wouldn't look at the cold hard facts you mentioned or I and @MastanKhan mentioned many times.

The problem is that there would always be people who could easily swayed away from propaganda.

I still remember PAF chief's comments after the OBL incident.
He said something on these lines, "what you wanted us to do, there were American fighter jets waiting on the other side of the border if we responded to their raid".
What better example of cowardice is there!!

I had been asking these sane questions for years without one single Pakistani, I repeat one single Pakistani able to provide the answers.

1- How the Seals from the "destroyed" helicopter boarded the remaining other helicopter!! Impossible according to the pay load carrying ability of the chopper. Therefore, what happened to them!!

2- To raid the helicopters made 40/45 minutes journey in to Pakistan. Even if we consider that they were stealth and caught Pakistanis unguarded and avoided radars succesfully. What happened after the attack started!! They remain for 20 minutes and then took another 40 in Pakistani air space in return journey. Where was PAF all that time!!

Unfortunately, we have become a nation of accepting every kind of rape of national resources, our prides, our values, our people, our nation.

Even worse misfortune is that all those who are responsible for that rape of a nation, still claim that there is no better patriots than them.

Even more worse misfortune is that there are millions who accept such lies on the name of false "Patriotism".
This is not patriotism, it is "Ghaddari".

Well, it's been a year and i would have loved to see you or someone else posting something more than mere images of a battered Abhinandan being taken into custody or shown slurping some tea.

It's also in nature of some to digress other than digest, the difference is I'm claiming with substance without waving my hands in the air, at one time I belonged to a family of soldiers but looking around now, I can't recall a single person serving in the armed forces hence I don't make high claims '


Damn, that must be due to certain threads and discussions happening here on PDF, after all, everyone sitting behind a desk at say Heathrow has a computer in front of them, how difficult would it be for them to log in on PDF and judge us Pakistanis....or maybe they see how anytime a corrupt Pakistani politician or some Thekeedar of Islam lands at a Western airport, we Pakistanis throng there by coachloads to welcome our saviours.

When one considers others as garbage around him, I wonder who fancies himself as above others, a unique, privileged grandeur character whose head is in the clouds...well my friend this common folks forum is no place for any high flyers....so stop wasting yourself and let others continue...after all the site has continued to run for over a decade without appointment by HM the Queen.

Many here have said, nothing of substance had been shared or revealed, as per the claim with bold header.
Do read the thread properly.

Your Comments about the treatment of Pakistanis all around the world and attributing it to reading thread on PDF shows your mental immaturity. A nation reaches such low point after decades of their doing. Shame is people like you do not understand it despite clear cut evidences. When you look in to the mirror and still don't see the dark marks on your faces and conscious then there is something wrong with your eye sight and your brain functions.

Your comments and taunt about HM the Queen is even more childish. Deal with the facts instead of showing tantrum. Yes, if majority in Pakistan had educated themselves and had better IQs, Pakistan wouldn't be in a position we are now. No small thanks to those who had been leading Pakistan and claim to be the best and most patriotic leaders, despite running it to the grounds.
If only blinds could see what dark alley they had been dragged to.

 

[baqai]

i think this thread should have been titled "The face behind the airboss on surprise day" most of us came in this thread expecting to learn something new and conclusive (mostly on the flanker) and instead we get to see an already posted picture with a circle on it and name mentioned.

Thanks for educating those who were not aware of the name and face (like me)

 

[crankthatskunk]

oh boy what do you want from PA and PAF to start full fledged war with India and doom

So you are agreeing that they fear that in a war against India they would be doomed!!
And that fear of being doomed is stopping them from taking decisive actions. They prefer to take any and every blow thrown at them, if they react, they would be doomed!!

Could you please describe "Cowardice" to us now!!

 

[Pied Piper]

Forr the purpose of maintaining surprise to the enemies of Pakistan - this event should be remembered (withhout arrogance or gloating). As part of psychological Warfare...this reminder etc should be constantly narrated on all viable platforms (internet and social media etc.).

Yes, the IAF have learned a lot from this surprise...the PAF needs to ensure that new surprises are always given in the event if hostilities. The PAF capability has demonstrated to the IAF and it's supporters that despite the heavy purchase of modern aircraft and far superior AWACS/EW aircraft....it's poor tactics showed it's weaknesses. IAF strategy was initially sucessfull in that they were able to penetrate PAF defences for a short while and launched bombs/missiles on Pakistan territory (all missed their targets and were deemed a failure mission) ...but IAF could claim an initial success.

However, the PAF'S broad daylight counter strike was a 'master stroke - showing the ability to penetrate IAF defences, hit key strategic strikes, shoot 2 of their combat jets...put such chaos that the IAF/armed forces shooting down their own helicopter etc.
This counter strike has reiterated deterrence...it has made the IAF a lot more cautious....yes they will address their shortcomings....but the PAF will increase their'surprise' capability as well as addressing its own short comings.
For the purpose of psychological Warefare...this day needs to be remembered and reiterated in May sites/discussions/books etc.

 

[crankthatskunk]

War needs one thing which was true 10,000 years ago and even today ..money..
Where was the money ..
Pakistan was at defualt ..
India mean while has 500b+ in reserves..
We lost the war before it even started ..

true very true.
Now think and answer, who had stolen the money!!
Who is responsible for not progressing Pakistan!!

And who is responsible to give NROs those criminals who have looted Pakistan, not once but twice!!!
You see , we already know the traitors. But unfortunately we are willing to back those traitors who have failed many times and still would fail in the future.

 

[The Eagle]

true very true.
Now think and answer, who had stolen the money!!
Who is responsible for not progressing Pakistan!!

And who is responsible to give NROs those criminals who have looted Pakistan, not once but twice!!!
You see , we already know the traitors. But unfortunately we are willing to back those traitors who have failed many times and still would fail in the future.

I will urge to not to divert the topic in hand. For what you are trying to say, there exist a lot of threads. Let's the political commentary stay away from Armed Forces threads.

Regards,

 

[Ultima Thule]

So you are agreeing that they fear that in a war against India they would be doomed!!
And that fear of being doomed is stopping them from taking decisive actions. They prefer to take any and every blow thrown at them, if they react, they would be doomed!!

Could you please describe "Cowardice" to us now!!

Oh bhai I am talking WE ARE DOOM NOT THEY, we are not in a position to start and sustain war with India either financially or politically, so get fairy tales sir

 

[Windjammer]

Many here have said, nothing of substance had been shared or revealed, as per the claim with bold header.
Do read the thread properly.

And many more have also acknowledged it but you would obviously miss that besides, don't follow one particular mindset crowd all the time, I'm sure you too have a brain..... utilize it.

Your Comments about the treatment of Pakistanis all around the world and attributing it to reading thread on PDF shows your mental immaturity. A nation reaches such low point after decades of their doing. Shame is people like you do not understand it despite clear cut evidences. When you look in to the mirror and still don't see the dark marks on your faces and conscious then there is something wrong with your eye sight and your brain functions.

You ideally remind me of the village character who visits a local doc complaining of stomach pains....the doc after checking him over subscribes him some eye drops, the dismayed patient inquires about the odd remedy, the doc explains, you need to first watch what you consume as your stomach pains are due to eating raw food.
I guess you also need to visit a shrink since your comments, arguments are nor here nor there.....I mean what kind of a bewildered character drags in social issues in a thoroughly defense-related topic.
Certainly your brain is malfunctioning and needs a break.

Your comments and taunt about HM the Queen is even more childish. Deal with the facts instead of showing tantrum. Yes, if majority in Pakistan had educated themselves and had better IQs, Pakistan wouldn't be in a position we are now. No small thanks to those who had been leading Pakistan and claim to be the best and most patriotic leaders, despite running it to the grounds.
If only blinds could see what dark alley they had been dragged to.

Sometimes it's necessary to deal with a particular mindset in the language they understand, you have repeatedly thrown your dummy out of the pram.....dragging in all Pakistani vows in this thread and giving yourself all self-importance and then talk about tantrums.
Here let me give you a little advice, knowing that you have all the free time at hand, search around, this forum has all different sections to address particular topics, defence-related threads aren't meant to discuss Pakistanis working in Takeaways or driving Cabs and if we were privileged as those living in DHA, we wouldn't be languishing here and even if we have made it successful, doesn't mean we should forget our reality....be brave and look into the mirror, maybe you will remember that once you were also part of the garbage that you now so openly detest.....address the issues accordingly, not just to merely save your skin when you run out of argument.

 

[crankthatskunk]

I will urge to not to divert the topic in hand. For what you are trying to say, there exist a lot of threads. Let's the political commentary stay away from Armed Forces threads.

Regards,

Ok, I will take your advice, no problems.

But what I say is relevant. We know who gave NROs to the corrupt Politicians, therefore, it is on the topic.

Oh bhai I am talking WE ARE DOOM NOT THEY, we are not in a position to start and sustain war with India either financially or politically, so get fairy tales sir

And my dear brother, I was also talking about us, not them.
They refer to those who make decisions on Pakistanis side, not Indians or Afghans.
I couldn't care less for the Indians.
I rightly worried for Pakistanis and Pakistan. We are not learning any lessons, be it in political field or in the military.