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Lol, again ppl will judge who is dodging facts and just spouting rhetoric. lol, you don’t claim to be a secularist liberal. Great- I don’t claim to be a right-winger either. If I don’t know you, you don’t know me. I never studied Pakistani history in a Pakistani school. So your argument is just...

Lol, I just gave more refs besides Rao for the only thing I used Rao to justify. Suffice it to say that people who read this exchange will see who is dodging who. Lol, I quote your own liberal sources to prove points in the timeline. I do this because then you simply can’t dodge the facts of...

Again you dodge the pertinent references I have made in this thread. I only quoted Rao in this other thread for the singular purpose in the other thread to show how Nadwi Sahab was called from India to advise on the objectives resolution in 1948, while Jinnah was alive no less, although he...

Meanwhile all you seculars are going to dodge the forest for the trees- that the CAP under Jinnah no less elected a Shaykh Al islam. In Jan 1948. That Jinnah regularly met ulema and assured them that their principles of Islam would be incorporated into the state constitution. That Jinnahs own...

So let’s get this straight. I make some claims on this thread. You ask for proof. I provide them. You ignore said proofs and quote something I said in another thread to make a claim about how I am dodging the question? Meanwhile, i quote Jinnah you ignore it? And tell me not to quote him? Got...

Where in the references above did I quote Rao? I have not quoted him at all here on this thread. Please let me know where in my thread with timeline and references I quote Rao. I feel serious pity that you have to say I quote an individual I don’t even quote. My timeline and references are there.

You are a fraud to claim this. Jinnah asked the ulema to advise the committee and included them in said committee. And he accepted their suggestions for said committee numerous times. Lol- I’m not sure how much you are comparing anything. Nope and I provided evidence for what I said about...

Bro, you are gaslighting. Ignoring what I am have written and trying to say that I have said things I have simply not said. What I have said, I have backed up. No interest in trying to prove things I have not said.

I actually agree a great deal with what you have said. I disagree with the underlying assumptions however. Islam does not give us a system of government. It does not tell us to be a kingdom or a democracy or something else. Rather, it gives us principles of engagement (God given rights...

Bro, What even are you on about. Now you are just trolling and gaslighting. Syed Sulayman Nadvi and indeed the other students of Shibli Nomani also believed in democracy. They believed that democracy was not only compatible with Islam but ideal. JI or Maududi never claimed to my knowledge...

Here is timeline with references:- 1947:- independence and the first constituent assembly meets (CAP). Tasked with drafting constitution, etc. Jan 1948:- CAP appoints Usmani elected shaykh Al Islam, head mufti. He will be the main interlocutor on the drafting committee with the ulema and...

This is simply false. Jinnah was alive when the committee to draft the objectives resolution was selected. That is a fact. Your saying it is not does not change it. It is also a fact that Jinnah did select religious scholars to advise the committee and that some people on said committee were...

PDM shud hold elections then- voters can reward PDM for wanting to hold elections at same time. What a stupid and irrelevant opinion poll

Complete rubbish post. Totally misses the point and is completely absurd. Jinnah wanted a republic - a democratic state. He wanted an Islamic republic - one that enshrined and married democracy with the principles of Islam. That was consistent with our values and history. All of his quotes...

This is exactly right. Idealism plus islam gives us democracy and secularism that is adequate and appropriate but only in the context of our own civilization and values. Being an Islamic republic does not mean we can also not be a civil secular state that protects minority rights and has freedom...

“I do not know what the ultimate shape of this constitution is going to be but I am sure that it will be of a democratic type, embodying the essential principles of Islam.” Pg 1 from Jinnah archives. Jinnah wanted a democratic state with Islamic principles. I do not support Zia or his...

Here. Islamic principles enshrined in republic that is to be Pakistan.

If your point is that Pakistan is not meant to be a theocracy, no one has said that. But Pakistan was always supposed to a democratic state that enshrined the principles of Islam. Ie an Islamic republic. Not merely a democratic republic for Muslims notice, ie a Muslim state. Jinnah is...

I already gave the context of the said quotes. They do not preclude us being an Islamic republic. See my earlier post Here

Excuse me PDM lot, can you please explain when we developed the refining capacity to refine Russian crude oil? I thought we could not refine Russian oil at least that’s what you all said when PTI was in the last phase to acquire it. When did we develop the refining capacity or are we going to...